04/19/24
May 19, 2006
Garner, Springer suspended for "beaning" Bonds: Well...it WAS obvious that Springer was throwing at Bonds, but with their history, who can understand why not.
posted by chemwizBsquared to baseball at 02:57 PM - 49 comments
I would have supported a longer suspension. You can't have people throwing at your franchise players.
posted by fenriq at 03:44 PM on May 19, 2006
but with their history What history is that? There was nothing in the article you linked that suggested any "history" between Springer and Bonds. Is there some implied history that I don't know about? including one that hit Bonds' bat handle for strike one. Actually, video replay showed that the ball grazed Bonds' elbow guard first, so he should have been awarded first base at that time. What hasn't been mentioned enough is how calm and professional Bonds was during that whole debacle. I'm pretty sure that a large portion of the MLB batters would have at least done some threatening (bat pointing, slow walking, cursing) towards the pitcher after the first 4 pitches. Bonds, however, did nothing. Which I'm sure pissed the hell out of Springer, the Houston fans, and all of Bonds' detractors. After he got plunked, I fully expected him to slowly walk towards the mound. Instead, he took his base and made no deal about it. I'm sure some hard-case Bonds-hater will come in here and say things like "he deserved it" or "he's a pussy for not rushing the mound" or "if he ran at the pitcher, no one would have come out to help him". To quickly stifle that, let me say: a) No one should have a ball thrown at them like that. It's dangerous, and unless you advocate deliberately injuring players, it's nothing anyone wants to see. b) It takes a strong man to NOT get provoked. Jason Kendall is a weak man, Barry Bonds is a strong man. c) His teammates would have come out to help him if he DID rush the mound. He's their mealticket. When he plays, he dramatically increases his team's chance of winning.
posted by grum@work at 03:47 PM on May 19, 2006
Here is some info on their history. If there is a history between Springer, the veteran reliever, and Bonds, it is stretched over a half-decade. Bonds homered against Springer, then with the Diamondbacks, on May 28, 2001, the 24th home run of his record-breaking 73. The next time they opposed each other, on Sept. 21, 2004, Springer hit Bonds in the shin. On Tuesday night, Springer made it two in a row.
posted by bperk at 04:03 PM on May 19, 2006
I'm guessing that Springer is just throwing at Barry out of steroid-hatred and spite.
posted by chicobangs at 04:13 PM on May 19, 2006
If pitchers giving up homers to Bonds means they have a "history", then Bonds has history with a good deal of the pitchers in baseball. I think pitchers don't like Bonds hanging himself over the plate (hence, the body armor) and have every right to pitch him tight in order to back him off the strike zone. So Bonds decided not to charge Springer....perhaps because he expects pitchers to react that way if he crowds the plate, or, more likely, because he's aware that charging the mound would further deteriorate his image. Whatever the reason, I'm glad he held back. The best way to get even with that is to hit one out the next time he faces him, which he probably will.
posted by eccsport78 at 04:21 PM on May 19, 2006
grum, excellent point about Bonds not allowing himself to get angry. Even having been hit at 95 in the shoulder. I've always wondered how the "roid rage" argument washes out against his pretty even temperament, especially given the volume of noise directed at him. bperk, so by Springer's math, he gets to hit him twice for each homerun? He got his hit back in, now he's just being a dick. A good test of how to think about this is insert your favorite player of choice into Bonds' shoes. You want some prick with a grudge unleashing fastballs up around his head? I actually think any pitcher who intentionally throws above the chest should be automatically tossed. A baseball to the head is very, very bad. No batter should have to worry about getting hit in the head.
posted by fenriq at 04:25 PM on May 19, 2006
I don't care for Bonds or his attitude towards the average fan/sportswriter. Do I like to watch him swing a bat? Hell yes! Throwing inside is part of the game but what Springer did is over the line and , for that matter, so were the Houston fans. The Giants were handing the Astros their own asses for the 2nd consecutive game(the scores in the series? 10-1, 14-3,10-1), and the game was for all purposes, out of reach. Springer deserves a stiffer penalty, as it was obvious that he was throwing at Barry, continuing to do so after he missed him! Two things I noticed however, Grum: 1. The Giants pitcher, Jamey Wright, did NOT retaliate, where most other pitchers/teams would have, especially since Bonds IS their meal ticket. 2. Most of the Houston fans, who were there to see 714, left the house after Barry was taken out of the game.
posted by mjkredliner at 04:33 PM on May 19, 2006
"perhaps because he expects pitchers to react that way if he crowds the plate, or, more likely, because he's aware that charging the mound would further deteriorate his image." Could it also be, perhaps, that he's just not as much of a jerk as a lot of people think? That maybe he's actually a calm and even-tempered (albeit prickly) guy? "The Giants pitcher, Jamey Wright, did NOT retaliate" Bonds specifically asked him not to. Good for him.
posted by sellout at 04:46 PM on May 19, 2006
> Could it also be, perhaps, that he's just not > as much of a jerk as a lot of people think? Nope. A friend of mine is a sports doctor and he has some friends on the training staff at the Giants. He says the only people there who *don't* hate Bonds are the new players, who will hate him by the end of the season. He says only 5% of Bonds' asshole-ishness ever makes it into the media.
posted by drumdance at 05:10 PM on May 19, 2006
Fenriq, I agree with you and would support a longer suspension for such directed behavior. But I don't think there should be a difference in penality if it is a franchise player or not. I am unclear if you were implying so.
posted by T$PORT4lawschool at 05:16 PM on May 19, 2006
I'm guessing that Springer is just throwing at Barry out of steroid-hatred and spite. By that virtue, there should be a whole lot of batters heaving lumber at the pitchers, since around half of the players suspended for breaking the steroid policy have been pitchers.
posted by grum@work at 05:30 PM on May 19, 2006
Its always a matter of who gets hit and who throws the pitch. If Clemens or Shilling hit Bonds everyone would be talking about how a pitcher has to throw inside to be successful, and that's why those two are so great! Let Bonds take off his armor and then maybe we could really see how brave he really is!
posted by INOALOSER at 05:34 PM on May 19, 2006
He deserved it, he's a pussy for not rushing the mound, and if he ran at the pitcher, no one would have come out to help him. /tongue in cheek
posted by irunfromclones at 05:45 PM on May 19, 2006
Springer should be benched for more than 4 games. No way it should take 5 pitches to hit Bonds.
posted by irunfromclones at 05:50 PM on May 19, 2006
Quote from Garner "I don't think that Russ was throwing at him," Garner said. "I think that the first couple of pitches were indicative of him trying to get the ball in on him." I'm guessing that Garner was just saying that to back up his pitcher because I don't think Springer's intent could have been anymore obvious. Regardless of the steroid issue, throwing a ball at a batter five times is wrong. A four game suspension does not even come close to what Springer deserves. I find it remarkable that Bonds kept his cool when he could easily justify charging the mound.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 06:23 PM on May 19, 2006
It's especially hard to not hurt someone when you're using steroids. I admire him in one way but don't in another.
posted by rhkett at 07:13 PM on May 19, 2006
One of the first couple of pitches was behind Bonds. He beaned him on purpose.
posted by kirkaracha at 07:21 PM on May 19, 2006
Springer should be benched for more than 4 games. No way it should take 5 pitches to hit Bonds. Good one.
posted by mjkredliner at 07:30 PM on May 19, 2006
"He deserved it, he's a pussy for not rushing the mound, and if he ran at the pitcher, no one would have come out to help him." hahaha....there is another excellent theory as to why he didn't charge the mound.......the only teammates that would have come to his aid would have been the new guys who don't know him enough to hate him!
posted by eccsport78 at 07:33 PM on May 19, 2006
Yet another reason not to charge......giving 25 Houston Astros an excuse to beat the living steriods out of him.
posted by eccsport78 at 07:36 PM on May 19, 2006
"A baseball to the head is very, very bad. No batter should have to worry about getting hit in the head." True. So stop standing in the strike zone. Can you imagine what Don Drysdale might have done had someone come up to the plate back in his day with body armor on?? It's probably a good thing Barry has reinforced his head size over the years, he may need the extra padding. I agree, you don't want to see anyone get beaned, but there sure are a lot of batters crowding the plate these days. Today's hitters are lucky guys like 'ol Don are gone, for the most part anyway.
posted by eccsport78 at 07:51 PM on May 19, 2006
I wished that he had hit Barry in the face... that would knock some sense into him.
posted by redsoxrgay at 07:57 PM on May 19, 2006
lol- just kidding
posted by redsoxrgay at 07:57 PM on May 19, 2006
Can you imagine what Don Drysdale might have done had someone come up to the plate back in his day with body armor on? Am I the only one completely sick of Don Drysdale being held up as some paragon of the American frontier, meting and doleing rough justice to players dumb enough to stand in the batter's box and try to play the game? It's just above Bob Feller talking about how much the game sucks today on my list of things I love.
posted by yerfatma at 08:55 PM on May 19, 2006
Catcher Eric Munson said Springer intended to pitch Bonds inside but not hit him. If I may be so bold, Bullshit!
posted by Folkways at 08:58 PM on May 19, 2006
I have no real issue with BB, one way or the other. To me, records are merely numbers, but I can only wonder how Gibson or Drysdale would have dealt with this "stud". Gibson once said he'd hit HIS MOM if she crowded "his space". Favorite Gibby story: He faces some schlub who payed to play in a "fantasy week" game. The guys bunts for a hit. Next time up, Gibby drills him in the back on the first pitch. "What was HE thinking?", 45 wonders...
posted by wolfdad at 08:59 PM on May 19, 2006
Hey if we're talking about pitchers throwing inside on their relatvies, it has to be mentioned Roger Clemens vs. Koby Clemens, brushing him off the plate. "This guy threw at his own son during a father-son game!" That being said, I have no opinion on Bonds or Springer.
posted by uglatto at 09:59 PM on May 19, 2006
I don't see a problem with pitchers hitting players in the ass, but batters earn some of the blame. Many are putting their own heads over the plate. Baseball has helped batters since the late 60s. What have they done for pitchers? Take the armor away or let pitchers hit batters. Better yet...start calling the strike on those batters hit while leaning over the plate. A separate issue is batters taking a minute to trot the bases after preening while watching their home run. The pitchers to those batters should be allowed the plunk those assholes twice for free.
posted by ?! at 11:47 PM on May 19, 2006
I somehow don't see this as a Bonds-crowding-the-plate issue. This is a Springer-taking-his-personal-issues-out-on-Bonds issue. The Commissioner's Office (not to mention Congress) are already way up Barry's ass. There's no need for some hotheaded yahoo to take potshots at him on top of that. Springer has done this every time he's faced Barry. It's his poorly-thought-out attempt at vigilante justice, and you can't discourage it enough. This borders on intent to injure. (And this isn't about Bonds; a major league ballfield is not a place to take out internal vendettas, whatever they may be.) I'd have given him 10 games, not 4. It's not 1915 anymore. You can't let this shit happen.
posted by chicobangs at 12:01 AM on May 20, 2006
T$PORT4lawschool, why not? Franchise players are worth far more than scrub call ups. I don't think any player should be getting beaned, especially not for a misguided sense of personal justice but yeah, I do think punishments should be more severe for attacking a team's most valuable player.
posted by fenriq at 12:58 AM on May 20, 2006
Bonds was hanging over the inside of the plate and that belongs to the pitcher. Take away his elbow armor and see if he does that for long. Oh I wish Bob Gibson could face this asshole.
posted by wdminott at 03:02 AM on May 20, 2006
Maybe a helmet shot like Sosa got would of started his downward streak of slowly fading away.All these ballplayer's are pussies.Especially with all the body armour Bonds wears...mommmy....i got hit by a ball today.....
posted by irishmic2004@sbcglobal.net at 06:07 AM on May 20, 2006
MLB does whatever it can to protect their hero Barry Bonds, its ridiculous. If it had been any other player the situation would go unnoticed. And what's wrong with throwing at a cheater like Barry Bonds? Bonds is the one who should be suspended...permanantly.
posted by tim at 10:43 AM on May 20, 2006
Neutral arguments !! First off, I'm not a Barry Bonds fan in any way. Sure he's been accused of steroid use, but steroids don't improve hand eye coordination. He still has to have some natural tallent. Sure, no matter what, when he does tie and pass Babe Ruth on the Home Run list, and if he does ever get close or pass Hank Aaron, any homerun records that Bonds sets will forever be looked at as a tainted record. Now as far as Springer throwing at Bonds, obviously none of those pitches were curve balls or sliders, but direct fastballs aimed at a human target and not a strike zone. I don't believe the B.S. excuse that they were trying to brush Bonds off the plate. The suspension rule in baseball needs to be changed. If a pitcher gets himself suspended for 4 games, the son of a bitch doesn't even miss a start based on a 5 man rotation. After he pitches, he's off for 4 games anyway. Whatever the number of games a pitcher gets suspended for should be imposed as being his next scheduled starts for that many games. Also when a pitcher does get that kind of suspension, the team should not be allowed to activate any additional players from their Minor League clubs to fill the void. If a manager knowingly allows his pitcher to throw directly at a guy and he gets suspended, the team as a whole should be penalized as far as not being able to fill that position. They should have to use a reliever as a starter while the suspension is being served or go with a 4 man rotation. When an everyday player gets suspended, he's missing every game where he would normally be playing in. Pitchers should face that same discipline. Four games should be 4 starts. As far as Bonds is concerned, I personally hope he never hits another home run again. PEACE OUT !!
posted by FUDSTER at 10:43 AM on May 20, 2006
If anything, a nice piece of cranial armor would be my ideal in a major league batter's box. I got hit in the left eye by a 75 mph pitched ball in high school, and it was like a very focused little train wreck, right on the side of the ol' noggin. It broke my orbital bone and left a lovely "bruise tattoo" of the stiches in the baseball, along with a full palate of deep, majestic colors for nearly a month, and headaches for a week. And this was from a high school pitcher! The pitchers just get bigger and stronger as they advance through the levels; your head generally doesn't get much harder or tougher...biologically speaking, of course. Now, I'm not callin' anybody a pussy because they did or didn't play baseball or anything like that, but I'll agree that it hurts like a motherfucker to get hit by a baseball.
posted by The_Black_Hand at 10:54 AM on May 20, 2006
It still makes me laugh how so many people act like they want Bonds put in solitary confinement the rest of his life because he added muscle with the aid of steroids. Christ, get over it. It's a freakin' game, and the people who run that game never wanted to do a damn thing about steroids until they were forced to. MLB was very willing to keep raking in cash by the truckload, so they're all in this together. Face it, steroids are a part of baseball's recent history, and Barry Bonds is only the tip of the iceberg when talking about guys who used. As for throwing at the guy, why does Houston have what is basically a nobody like Springer throw at Bonds? Why not have Oswalt or Pettite throw at him? Because if a suspension comes about, they don't want any of those guys missing time. They should be suspended for a long time. This throwing at a guy's head is bullshit. And I agree, anyone who calls Bonds or any other major league ballplayer a "pussy" is nothing but a jealous, couch potato non-athlete who's never stared down a 90-some mile per hour fastball coming at them. Don't sit and watch sports from the stands or on a TV screen and criticize the balls it takes for pro athletes to compete for keeps every day.
posted by dyams at 11:34 AM on May 20, 2006
A friend of mine is a sports doctor and he has some friends on the training staff at the Giants oh, a "friend of a friend" source. I'm sold. I wonder if it's the same one who said he saw Troy Aikman coming out of a gay bar in Dallas. Am I the only one completely sick of Don Drysdale being held up as some paragon of the American frontier, meting and doleing rough justice to players dumb enough to stand in the batter's box and try to play the game? no, you are not. If he played today he'd be handling the same way all the other ones handle it, while someone would be saying "Can you imagine if it was Bob Gibson pitching today instead of Drysdale?"
posted by bdaddy at 12:04 PM on May 20, 2006
poor mic!! the only thing Barry will be breaking is ruth's record.. Yeah and we all beleive you about your b.a. and that you just happen to be the NCAA record holder for being hit by a pitch..funny life truly is like a box of chocalte... isn't it forrest?
posted by PGHTOS at 01:50 PM on May 20, 2006
Gimme some of that chocalte.
posted by Texan_lost_in_NY at 02:03 PM on May 20, 2006
fighting on the internet is like the special olympics.... As a volunteer for the Special Olympics should I find this offensive? And if yall really need to have a pissing match please take it to e-mail. ok I feel better
posted by Folkways at 03:11 PM on May 20, 2006
Nice. While I'm distracted reading the comments on Bonds getting plunked, I end up missing him tie Ruth. /shakes fist at no one in particular
posted by Dayf at 03:40 PM on May 20, 2006
//Shakes fist at grammar teacher for not teaching me English more gooder
posted by Dayf at 03:53 PM on May 20, 2006
Bonds was hanging over the inside of the plate and that belongs to the pitcher. Did you watch the video? Bonds doesn't hang over the inside of the plate. He stands in the batters box. At no time are his arms over the plate, until he actually swings the bat. In contrast, watch plunk-master Biggio or multiple-hand-fracture Bagwell. Biggio pretty much straddles the plate, while Bagwell's massive uppercut swing causes him to dive over the plate to the point where his head is in the original strike zone. Bonds: hit by a pitch an average of 5.51 times per 162 games played Bagwell: hit by a pitch an average of 9.64 times per 162 games played Biggio: hit by a pitch an average of 17.24 times per 162 games played
posted by grum@work at 08:18 PM on May 20, 2006
Well,at least when i went to college i learned how to spell words.( You dumb jock)...and you refer to Forrest Gump,now who's really the tard?For all i know i'm arguing with a cornhole ingrate who obviously barely skated thru the education system.Fat and bald now, working at walmart to boot.And to Folkway's...take it any way you want to. Have a nice day
posted by irishmic2004@sbcglobal.net at 08:46 PM on May 20, 2006
Good point Grum- Bonds dosent crowd the plate, and the pitcher was definately trying to deck him.
posted by redsoxrgay at 01:03 PM on May 21, 2006
well.. with grum's stats, i'm suprised bond's hits by pitch aren't higher...i remember pete rose didn't give a shit about gettin hit, it was about getting on base,creating an opportunity to score runs..hey.. it takes balls to allow a 90 mile an hour fastball to hit you...take one for the team,boys..
posted by ktown at 05:41 PM on May 22, 2006
Well,at least when i went to college i learned how to spell words.( You dumb jock)...and you refer to Forrest Gump,now who's really the tard?For all i know i'm arguing with a cornhole ingrate who obviously barely skated thru the education system.Fat and bald now, working at walmart to boot.And to Folkway's...take it any way you want to. Have a nice day Please tell me this is some piece of weird performance-web-art. Poor punctuation and capitilization, all the while trumpeting his own education and demeaning someone else for supposedly having a lack of education? That's just too damn funny.
posted by grum@work at 11:06 PM on May 22, 2006
Bonds got handled, thirties style, I guess.
posted by tselson at 01:46 PM on May 23, 2006
I have no problem with pitchers not pitching hitable balls to Baroid Bonds. However throwing at the batter is unacceptable behavior. Suspenion was a good call.