12/21/24
June 04, 2006
So much for Pujol's run at the HR and RBI records: St. Louis Cardinals first baseman Albert Pujols, the major league leader in HRs (25) and RBIs (65), injured his right oblique muscle in Saturday's game and might miss up to six weeks. He was on pace for 74 HRs and 192 RBIs, both of which would've been new MLB records.
posted by donnnnychris to baseball at 02:53 AM - 36 comments
ya that sucks. they say Pujos is a great guy and hes definatley fun to waatch when he has that perfect swing going
posted by bronxbomber at 09:09 AM on June 04, 2006
I guess that makes Alfonso Soriano, whom everyone dissed at the beginning of the season, as the favorite to win the NL MVP award. I doubt Alfonso is going to be around long enough to win it. Plus, Pujols can put up numbers in 120 games at this pace that'll shatter everyone else's season. He's still a prime MVP candidate.
posted by dfleming at 09:38 AM on June 04, 2006
I still think Pujols will take the MVP. Just because he's injured (hopefully he gets well soon) doesn't mean he'll get passed over. Being a well-conditioned athlete, he shouldn't be out too long. It just depends on the severity of the strain.
posted by wingnut4life at 09:50 AM on June 04, 2006
I think Pujols is a fantastic player and a true bargain for the bucks he's being paid when compared to the likes of Johnny Damon, A-Rod, etc. Any comments about whether he'll stay a true Cardinal when his next contract is up (when is that, anyway) or will he be tempted with too much money by the BIG MONEY teams in the AL East?
posted by bmoyd34 at 10:02 AM on June 04, 2006
Now I dont feel as bad for trading him off of my fantasy team. But, thats really a shame to see this guy get injured. He was having a monster season.
posted by redsoxrgay at 10:09 AM on June 04, 2006
Damn, not a day went by that I hoped and wished he could bring down the single season record by Barry. So much for that. He is still an amazing player (Pujols that is) Oh well, just like everyone else is saying he will probably be able to at least win the MVP. You never know he might still hit sixty homers this year. If he does he will be my single season homerun king, right up there with Maris and Ruth......Sammy who?
posted by sgtcookzane at 10:23 AM on June 04, 2006
Although his injury is a shame,it comes before the all-star break.The second half of the season,he will be right back in the groove,showing everybody why he is the MVP.As a diehard Cubs fan,I hope the same can be said for D Lee.
posted by Tubby Fan at 10:28 AM on June 04, 2006
Damn.
posted by jerseygirl at 11:06 AM on June 04, 2006
I think Pujols is a fantastic player and a true bargain for the bucks he's being paid when compared to the likes of Johnny Damon, A-Rod, etc. Let's not overstate the fact. He did earn $11,000,000 last year. He's no Miguel Cabrera. You never know he might still hit sixty homers this year. If he does he will be my single season homerun king, right up there with Maris and Ruth......Sammy who? So 73HR in 153 games is an obvious sign of steroids, but 60HR in 120 games would be beyond reproach?
posted by grum@work at 11:31 AM on June 04, 2006
Puhols isn't really about records. He is just a great hitter. Watching him often I sometimes pity the pitcher who gets him out too easily in his first at-bat. You can almost see Albert thinking about the at-bat. The next time up: BANG. St. Louis has been richly blessed. Stan the Man and Albert the Great in one lifetime.
posted by rchugh at 11:33 AM on June 04, 2006
The Cardinals gave Pujols a $100 million, seven-year contract on Friday, a deal that would be worth $111 million if St. Louis exercises an option for 2011. So the Jays can't take a shot at hime until next decade. (You did mean that big money team in the AL East, right?)
posted by loquax at 11:35 AM on June 04, 2006
So 73HR in 153 games is an obvious sign of steroids, but 60HR in 120 games would be beyond reproach? Great point grum!! Its funny how selective people can be after they alreday made up thier minds about a person.
posted by PGHTOS at 11:37 AM on June 04, 2006
So 73HR in 153 games is an obvious sign of steroids, but 60HR in 120 games would be beyond reproach? Grum, people wont accuse Pujols of using steroids, largely because he was always good. He didn't jump form like being a 30+ homerun hitter to doubling his record the next year. Plus, Bonds admitted to using steroids, except he took them without "knowing what they were". Pujols has a much better public image, and isnt cocky. It's really unlikely that he will be accused of using steroids anytime soon.
posted by redsoxrgay at 12:09 PM on June 04, 2006
He didn't jump form like being a 30+ homerun hitter to doubling his record the next year. 43, 46, 41, 74?
posted by qbert72 at 01:01 PM on June 04, 2006
Absolutely. It's a huge jump in homers. The automatic steriods assumption has to apply, if that's your primary argument against Bonds. If not, maybe you have to consider that there are hitters out there capable of producing these feats - and Bonds is one of them. Steriods or no steriods. Pujols may help exonerate Barry, in a fashion.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 01:27 PM on June 04, 2006
Roger Maris: 1957 hr 14 1958 hr 28 1959 hr 16 1960 hr 39 1961 hr 61 1962 hr 33 I guess the automatic steroid assumption has to apply to Maris also. Get over it. Bonds is a great player but there is no way in hell he does what he does with the bat without the juice. They ought to run McGwire, Sosa and the mega punk Bonds out of baseball. Pujols will be back and I hope that the Cards can hang on until then.
posted by st.louie at 01:39 PM on June 04, 2006
Yea- but Bonds homrun jump was when most players are in retirement. He was supposed to be way past his prime, but then socks over 70 homers? The he admitted to using steroids. Pujols is nearing, or is in his prime. That's why its more believeable that Pujols isn't on steroids.
posted by redsoxrgay at 01:42 PM on June 04, 2006
All those big homer guy's were juiced,c'mon.Albert was not that big his rookie year, i have many pic's from spring training to prove it.He probally stopped when the hammer came down like the rest of them.Great player yes,alway's has been.Juiced in the beginning,yes.Now,if they test negative there is nothing you can do but you have to be goofy to think he was never on supplements.Denial is killing the average baseball fan for sure.I'm not taking anything away from him,he's great to watch and got shafted on the MVP because of Baroid Bonds.Dont' forget.. roids causes many injuries that would normally never happen even after years of not using.
posted by irishmic2004@sbcglobal.net at 03:06 PM on June 04, 2006
Head hurts.
posted by SummersEve at 04:51 PM on June 04, 2006
Spoken like a completely unbiased Chicago fan, mic. /sarcasm
posted by igottheblues at 05:27 PM on June 04, 2006
Irishmic, I think just about every pro sports guy should be bigger in comparison to their rookie year. Show me a college/junior college/amatuer league with the money, workout facilities and support staff (physical therapists, trainers, et al) to match the big leagues for any sport and maybe you will have a point. You say Albert is great to watch, but are you really watching him? If you were, you would see that as soon as possible after just about every at bat he is down in the clubhouse reviewing tape of what just went down and other related incidents. He's good because he is a serious student of the game. I know that's hard to swallow since good old fashion hard work has lost its luster in this day and age.
posted by cardsfan at 05:30 PM on June 04, 2006
NO doubt Albert is a great player and a clean one for that matter. But to say ALL of baseball is at a loss with him going down is just retarded. You think the NL Central teams or their fans are all that upset? I think not, this gives the rest of the teams in the division a shot at over taking the Cards for the fist time in a while. Then again, getting back to reality, Albert will be back sooner than later and still put up monster numbers and still win the MVP, and the Cards will(I'M sorry to say) still win the Central. Damn, and I thought my Cubbies could make a come back and make a run at it this year.
posted by cub82 at 07:21 PM on June 04, 2006
irishmic,
if Albert "probally stopped when the hammer came down like the rest of them." How do you explain his jump in HR's per at bat this season? :o)
posted by Steeler_Fan at 07:27 PM on June 04, 2006
cub82, you're probably right. The NL Central teams aren't that upset. But you probably should take a look at the bigger picture. Because of all the steroids talk, Pujols has become the Muhammad Ali to Barry Bonds' George Foreman. Hero vs. villain. Real fans won't mind so much. They still have their hometown/favorite teams and favorite players. But the rest of the country, the people that will rally behind whomever is posh, have lost, at least for a while, someone who was probably deserving of their attention. Much like the home run chase of 1998 (with which I'm sure you are well familiar), Pujols record setting pace was helping bring fans in. Without him, who's left to bring in the unwashed masses?
posted by forrestv at 07:41 PM on June 04, 2006
grum@work, it's funny that you brought up the steroid question in this thread because my brother-in-law and I were discussing that today in regards to Pujols. What is one of the main signs of steroid use? Injuries, which Pujols seems to get from time to time. Not big injuries but muscle type injuries, because the steroids push the muscles too fast and cause them to strain or pull. That has pretty much been Pujols' injury M.O. for the past few years. When he goes down it's a strain or pull, for the most part. And I love the comparison in HR numbers. If Pujols had gone for 70 this year his four year total would almost match Bonds exactly for the four years that ended with Bonds' 73 HR season in 2001. For comparison: Bonds had 37, 34, 49 and then 73 Pujols had 43, 46, 41 and then this year's total... And the years following Bonds' 73 HR season he had 46, 45 and 45 HRs. If the juice worked so good why didn't he go all Sammy Sosa on us and blow past 60 every year? The comparison with Maris' numbers is telling because Maris never was a big-time power hitter (he did have some pop, but not overwhelmingly so) and then one season he belts 61. Yet, no one thinks he was on steroids. Why not? It's amazing how the public has completely demonized Bonds yet Pujols is the face of the "clean" era. Give me a break. I'm not saying Pujols has done steroids, but you can't ignore his sudden power surge and how he injured himself. He was running for a pop up, for pete's sake!!!!! I mean, c'mon, he's supposed to be a top athlete. He can't run back for a pop up without getting hurt? And once again, I'm not saying Bonds didn't use anything. I'm just saying everybody else in this equation, namely Pujols, should be looked at closer. Level the playing field, so to speak, in the investigative work done on these guys.
posted by donnnnychris at 08:20 PM on June 04, 2006
What is one of the main signs of steroid use? Injuries, which Pujols seems to get from time to time. Not big injuries but muscle type injuries, because the steroids push the muscles too fast and cause them to strain or pull. That has pretty much been Pujols' injury M.O. for the past few years. When he goes down it's a strain or pull, for the most part. This is the first time Pujols has been on the disabled list in his 5 1/2-year Major League career. Do you know of some kind of link from steroids to plantar fasciitis?
posted by Steeler_Fan at 08:44 PM on June 04, 2006
Just for the record, I don't think Pujols uses any PEDs (but then again, I didn't think Bonds did either, back in 2001...). I think what we are looking at is one of those rare superstar players who have "it", and can perform at a level that exceeds most people's expectations. Baseball Prospectus produced an article (by Jonah Kerri, called "The Prince is Dead, Long Live the King", only viewable if you have a subscription, which I highly recommend for a baseball fan) that listed the 10 greatest five-season starts to a career. It adjusted for league and park factors (so hitters in pitcher parks and pitcher-dominated seasons weren't punished, and hitters in tiny parks and hitting-frenzy seasons weren't unfairly rewarded) and was based on rate stats, not culmulative totals (so that partial seasons didn't hurt a player's rank).
- Ted Williams
- Frank Thomas
- Stan Musial
- Johnny Mize
- Joe Jackson
- Albert Pujols
- Dick Allen
- Dan Brouthers
- Lou Gehrig
- Joe DiMaggio
posted by grum@work at 10:26 PM on June 04, 2006
You're right, it is absolutely amazing company. It is just a shame that players like Canseco (so he says) brought steroids into the game at all. If is wasn't for that jerkoff, none of us would question the abilities of raw superstar talent like Pujols (assuming that he is not on the juice himself). I wish him well nonetheless, he's not an asshol* like Barry and at least treats the fans and media with respect. The last time I checked, the fans are what this game is supposed to entertain. Long live baseball.
posted by kmblives at 12:54 AM on June 05, 2006
Wow grum@work, that is an amazing list. I think Pujols is a great player, and I don't think he's juicing, but I just thought I'd bring up the point and start the discussion. Pujols seems like one of the honest ballplayers, if there is any of them left. As for the start of his career, if you figure out his home run pace for his first five years, it is 40.2 HRs a year. If you go deeper, he has hit home runs in 26.8 percent of the games he's played up to this point (226 HRs in 843 games). Let's say he misses 6 weeks and ends up playing 60 more games this year. He'll finish with 41 HRs if he maintains the 26.8-percent pace and his career total will be 242. Then project that pace over the next 10 years. He'll add 402 more HRs and be 36 years old with 644 HRs. That isn't that much of a reach to think he could average basically 40 HRs a year until he's 36 years old. Alex Rodriguez might eventually crash into the 700-HR club along with the Babe, Barry and Hank Aaron, but I think Pujols is the only current major leaguer with a shot at 800. If he maintained the pace I stated above for four more years he'd have 805 HRs at the age of 40. Maintaining that pace at that age is hard to do. Most of the game's sluggers throughout history have seen their long-ball production go down in their late 30s with few exceptions. That said, Pujols has set himself up for a run at it. I hope he can bounce back from this and stay healthy enough for the rest of his career to give it a shot. Wouldn't that be something? 800 freakin home runs!!!
posted by donnnnychris at 01:44 AM on June 05, 2006
This assuming his stated age is accurate.
posted by charlatan at 03:29 AM on June 05, 2006
of course, charlatan...assuming is age is correct.
posted by donnnnychris at 03:45 AM on June 05, 2006
Not big injuries but muscle type injuries, because the steroids push the muscles too fast and cause them to strain or pull. Actually, it's more common for steroid users to suffer injuries to joints versus muscles. The steroids help to strengthen the muscles around joints, but do nothing to help the bones in the joint, or, even worse, the connective tissues (ligaments, tendons, etc.). The increased strength generated by the muscles exerts more and more torque on the joint, until it finally gives way.
posted by The_Black_Hand at 05:11 AM on June 05, 2006
I long for the day when we can have ANY (practically) baseball conversation without it turning to steroids. Words can't convey how sick I am of that topic. Steroids are a fact in recent baseball history, so just deal with it. It's the same with greenies, prescription pain pills, you name it. Every time a player has a good couple of months now, we're going to have to talk about him using PEDs, which ultimately turns to Canseco, which then turns to Bonds, blah, blah, blah. Quit acting like the direction of humanity on earth has been altered because of a bunch of baseball players. Enjoy the game taking place on the field and stop worrying so much about a bunch of old records that don't really impact anyone's daily life at all anyways. Honestly, some of you act as if Barry Bonds pissed on your parents' grave or something. He's an overpaid entertainer, period. Sit back and enjoy the show.
posted by dyams at 07:21 AM on June 05, 2006
If everyone had not put so much pressure on Pujols to erase Bonds record. Redeem the sport. Give the game a nice clean, humble face he may still be playing. One of his best hits was on the media regarding Bonds. You still have to see and hit the ball, steroids cannot help with that. I am so with dyams. Let's embrace our drug driven era(always has been) of sports, (pain-killers etc) and enjoy the entertainment. Do you really want to go back to 40 homers leading the league. Mark Mc and his creotine put Baseball back on the map. As for the kids, parents watch your children. No drinkingor drugs that has always been the right way to raise them. We act as though this is the Curt Flood issue. Now that was important....And what about Selig? That maybe the real integrity of baseball question...
posted by Sputnik at 03:24 PM on June 05, 2006
100+ years of history can be wrong, that it?
posted by yerfatma at 09:22 AM on June 07, 2006
Wow. That really is too bad, for him, the Cardinals and baseball in general. I guess that makes Alfonso Soriano, whom everyone dissed at the beginning of the season, as the favorite to win the NL MVP award. And it will help all those fantasy league managers who chose A-Rod over Pujols with the first pick sleep a little easier now.