June 07, 2004

Congrats to Dave Andreychuk...finally gets one after 22 years. Congrats to John Tortorella...first American to coach a game 7 winner. Congrats to all of the Lightning...no matter where the team plays, everyone has equal chance to win 16 games, and they did it before anyone else did. And finally, congrats to the Calgary Flames. You boys made a run at it, and there's nothing to hang your heads about. Relish this series folks...it's likely to be a long time before we see another NHL game...

posted by MeatSaber at 10:05 PM on June 07, 2004

Fucking fuckity fuck....I was pulling so hard for the Flames. Relish this series folks...it's likely to be a long time before we see another NHL game... F'ing F'ity F again.

posted by Ufez Jones at 10:25 PM on June 07, 2004

Don't get me wrong: I don't feel that it's wrong that a team from Florida should win. (I should know; I have to put up with too many Leafs fans who have that attitude towards Carolina.) Just... everything else. That crappy five-on-three in Game 4. The clutching and grabbing that slowed the game to a crawl after Tampa Bay's first goal tonight. Bloody Bill McCreary and Kerry Fraser. Bloody obstruction. Bloody pathetic excuse for hockey.

posted by DrJohnEvans at 10:48 PM on June 07, 2004

There's too much complaining here. That was a great seven-game series, and players like Andreychuk, Richards, Khabubulin and -- especially -- St. Louis deserved to win after the way they played. I don't think I've ever seen a top player work harder than St. Louis did this series. I can't believe he was once picked up off the reject pile by a franchise many would have pegged as the NHL's worst at the time. This game proved once again that there's no sport that does a better championship celebration than the NHL. The first sight of the Stanley Cup always gives me goosebumps. As for the lockout, weirdly enough it brings pro hockey closer to me. Well, semi-pro hockey. Jacksonville's going to get one of the WHA teams that will try to sign NHL players if the league doesn't come back next season. I'm proud of my city for once again living up to its reputation as one of the places that joins every one of these no-hoper pro leagues. Anyone remember the mighty Jacksonville Bulls.

posted by rcade at 11:05 PM on June 07, 2004

:.( good run by calgary but I will remember that they lost this series as much as tampa won it. Calgary gained almost every advantage they could get - winning the first game on the road and having a chance to go up 2-0. winning game 3 and having a chance to go up 3-1. winning game 5 and having a chance to clinch the cup with game 6 at home (which is something that happens in like never). having a second crack to gain the cup in game 7 (the only game where home ice advantage really means something it would seem). they really seemed to come out flat. given the urgency they displayed in the last 12-15 minutes of the game... where was that team for the fisrt 45 minutes! i thought the call on ference, well, i didn't see it as a high stick but i suppose martin st louis with his head down is putting his head at chest-level of most players. if that was an open ice hit would they have called it? had calgary rushed the other way with st louis dazed in the corner they might have been able to pull the goalie and make it 6 on 4 and that would have been wrong. still, the cup was not lost with the gelinas non-goal or the ference hit. oh well. had vancouver cashed in a goal in OT in game 7 at home in the first round i wouldn't have had a chance to jump on the bandwagon for my old hometown team. the better team won. the thing I don't like about it is that a title would have meant way more to way more people if the other team had won it. and good luck keeping that lightning talent together for very long (based on this season each of st louis, richards and lecavalier would be THE GUY on most teams in the league). I guess the CBA will sort out the chances of that happening.

posted by gspm at 02:32 AM on June 08, 2004

DrJohn and Alex_reno, I agree that the refereeing sucked, but the good news for everyone is that it sucked for both teams involved. The penalty that the Flames scored on tonight was iffy, at best, and I thought that the Flames got the better of the decisions (or non-calls, mostly) in game seven. In other games, though, the calls have been in favor of the Lightning. The only people that lost because of the refs' bad decisions were the fans. Every team in the playoffs got screwed multiple times by bad calls this year. I thought this was the most entertaining Stanley Cup finals I can remember, and I don't think officiating had anthing to do with the outcome. The Lightning won, but I bet if this series was played ten times, the Flames would win five of them - and most of the time the series would go to seven games again. In any case, this playoff year showed that heart can beat skill. And that was really cool to see. Who would have guessed that Calgary could run through the teams they did? The Canucks AND the Redwings? No way that should have happened. The Flames just played their asses off. And I would have figured the Leafs or the Bruins or the Sens would have come out on top of the East. Maybe even the Flyers. The Lightning just outworked everyone, and played smart. I have tons of respect for St.Louis, Iginla, Richards, Conroy, Lecavalier, Regier, Kubina, and too many others that just went above and beyond during the playoffs. I wasn't emotionally invested in either team, which was kind of sad, but I believe this was one of the best finals ever. No kidding. I had a great time watching it, and if this is the last hockey I'll see for a while, I'm glad it was played well by both teams. Sorry about the long post. I have trouble sleeping sometimes. Oh, and for the record, that "Canada's Team vs. the USA" thing was bullshit. No one in the Northeast of the U.S. cared about Tampa Bay, and no one in Toronto or Montreal should have cared about Calgary. That is all. P.S. - Having said that, USA! USA! USA! P.P.S. - (Pre-emptively) Yes, I realize that the Bruins still sucked.

posted by Samsonov14 at 03:08 AM on June 08, 2004

Just in case anyone didn't catch it during the NBA Finals game 1, the owner of the Lightning, Bill Davidson, also owns the Detroit Pistons Actually, it's Bill Davidson, owner of the Pistons, also owns the Lightning... =D I've been saying that Billy will only win one championship this month...I pray the basketball gods are more forgiving than the hockey gods are known to be...go Pistons... =D

posted by MeatSaber at 07:06 AM on June 08, 2004

Great series...great game. The officiating was no better and no worse than in any of the other 14 playoff series this year, so Sutter and the Calgary fans just need to get over it. Congratulations Tampa. Congratulations Andreychuk (fellow Hamiltonian). And goodbye to NHL hockey for at least a year.

posted by rocket88 at 08:43 AM on June 08, 2004

Best analysis I've seen of the series so far is from the Toronto Star: A Flames victory would have not only given the Stanley Cup to the biggest underdog in NHL history, it would have been a triumph for Canada and the millions of true hockey fans that have endured a decade-long absence of the Cup on home soil. But true hockey fans should not be melancholy at all. Not only did the Lightning outnumber the Flames in Canadian-born players by a 12-10 margin among those who dressed for last night's game, their victory was a triumph for hockey. Their victory was a reward to those who believe that the most talented team, and not the one that drags the game down to the level of a crawl, should be the last team standing at the end of the season. The Lightning embodied their "Safe is Death" motto to the end and if that forces other NHL coaches to be less defensively consumed and more risky, then the game will be the biggest winner. I have to admit, in retrospect, that the Flames did have a few ugly moments: Fedotenko getting his face slammed into the boards, Lecavalier getting hit from behind (helmet attached or no, inexcusable), and then at the last moment, Ference high-sticks St. Louis in the face. Perhaps the most talented team won. This series was played with a lot of intensity. I remember watching (I think it was game 3) and Lecavalier and Iginla got in a fight. I was shocked. Two of the youngest, most talented forwards in the league throwing punches. Not only was it fun to watch but it underscored the physicality of the play. This series was very fast-paced, and with so much hitting, it made the brilliant moments of finesse play stand out even more (remember Lecavalier's final assist to Fedotenko when he did the spin and then between the legs of the D). Most importantly, at least to me, it shows that you can't simply spend your way to winning the cup. It's a lesson teams like Toronto should heed carefully.

posted by insomnyuk at 08:55 AM on June 08, 2004

Oh yeah...does Tampa winning mean that the "curse of the Habs" has been lifted? Maurice will not be pleased.

posted by DrJohnEvans at 08:58 AM on June 08, 2004

The high-stick by Ference on St. Louis with a minute left? The ref called it charging, but it was really high-sticking. Stick in face, blood on ice, instant penalty, no decision to be made. Yeah, that was an instant penalty. I think the issue is that the tripping penalty in the first was bullshit (led to a TB goal); and that there was another freaking high stick by Fedotenko before he scored goal two. In all fairness, the Pratt penalty in the third which led to a Calgary goal was garbage too -- but with these and that two-man-advantage in the other game and the non-call on the trip that led to the OT goal in Calgary, I think Sutter does have a case. UNLESS YOU ARE WAYNE FUCKING GRETZKY AND HIGH-STICK DOUG GILMOUR IN OVERTIME IN GAME 6!! YAAARGH! Funny that. It was the same ref! Kerry "Hair" Fraser. I hate that guy. He admits it was a missed call too... so maybe in a decade, he'll have some confessions for this series.

posted by mkn at 10:03 AM on June 08, 2004

Tampa played a good game, and Calgary simply didn't have anything left. Specifically Iginla simply could not produce another game 5. If Calgary played the entire game like they did in the last 10 minutes the outcome would have been different. Full credit to the Bolts. They played a hard fought series and came out on top. I was one of those people saying they didn't have it in them at the beginning of the playoffs. Boy was I ever wrong. A couple of comments: "The Trap" - I will argue that the Bolt's 'Safe Is Death' mantra is a crock. As soon as they took the lead in this series they fell back and played trap / obsruction hockey. Both teams did, but for some reason people only ever complained that the Flames played this way. It's the finals, and teams will do whatever they have to to win. If the league lets them they how can you really blame them. "Officiating" - See mkn's comments on the calls during game 7. I however disagree with the 'high stick' by Ference. St Louis was cut after he was hit and on his way into the boards. Hence Fraser didn't call it high sticking. It certainly wasn't charging either. It was a brutal call to seal the game for the Bolts. "The CBC" - As much as the ABC team may suck Cole and Neale on the CBC are a joke. I can't count the number of mistakes they made. You figure after 6 games they would get the players names right, but they can't even do that. They don't offer any insight on the current game but will gladly tell you about about a game from the '78 playoffs. Greg Millen looks good compared to those guys. All in all I still think this was a great series, and a great playoff. I hope something can be worked out and we actually have hockey in Sept. I'm really looking forward to the World Cup this August. It should be a great tournament.

posted by camcanuck at 11:02 AM on June 08, 2004

Man, I wish Team Canada really did have three Maurice Richards on it. Of course, having eight Lester B. Pearsons skating might slow us down a notch, and Lady Byng would probably be a healthy scratch.

posted by DrJohnEvans at 11:13 AM on June 08, 2004

it would go a long way towards removing seeds of ridiculous doubt springing up in Alberta, in Canada, and in every other city that has ever had a meaningful call go against their team. Wait a minute - Isn't Canada the capital city of the state of Alberta? Aside from your typo, I agree with you completely. I hope to see some changes in officiating whenever we get to see hockey again.

posted by Samsonov14 at 11:52 AM on June 08, 2004

FWIW, from that same attendance chart the Tampa Bay Lightning operated at 90.2% of capacity while the Flames were at 96.6%. Flames set a franchise record with an average attendance of 17,877 which included 30 sell-outs (a record that suprises me somewhat given that the arena capacity was about 20,500 or so back in the early 90s when they were good). Tampa also started the season with a Division title to defend while there was little optimism in Calgary. Plus the Flames were drawing 15000 or so fans to the watch the away games on TV at the dome in the finals. Plus Tampa was offering free beer to encourage season ticket sign ups - doesn't topping the Eastern Conference work? Deservingness or not, hockey in Tampa is more of a niche attraction than in Calgary. I wish the franchise success and all but would it have really hurt the hockey gods to have let the Flames score in OT in game 6? The Lightning have a team that should be around for a few more years. The Flames made a miracle run that they will probably not repeat. Tampa paper mistakenly runs an editorial lamenting a game 7 loss. If only.

posted by gspm at 12:11 PM on June 08, 2004

Flames set a franchise record with an average attendance of 17,877 which included 30 sell-outs (a record that suprises me somewhat given that the arena capacity was about 20,500 or so back in the early 90s when they were good). I believe the Saddledome has some sections with obstructed view seats which they made unavailable for years, although they did open those sections for this years playoffs.

posted by Stan Fields at 12:38 PM on June 08, 2004

I believe the 96 percent reflects the new figure because it has been years since the capacity has been reduced. It was more than just closing off some of the seats in the corners since a rennovation reduced capacity by increasing the size of some seats (if my not following the Flames by that time memory allows me to recall correctly). I was just point out the capacity figures to add a little to the attendance claim rather that shoot down the point completely. The Flames did win it all, once, and followed that up with a few good seasons that fizzled in the first round of the playoffs, a few seasons on the slide that fizzled in the first round of the playoffs (losing seven consecutive first round series) and then the league longest playoff drought. I don't think I'll listen to YOUR opinions about the hockey gods what with your support of Dallas having a recent Cup victory to reflect upon (on a disputed goal no less, no hockey god love for the Gelinas non-goal in game 6). In terms of levels of losing Calgary fans can make a claim to be a few levels below what Lightning fans would have felt.

posted by gspm at 01:15 PM on June 08, 2004

86 said all that needs to be said. The NHL needs to do something... and then stick to it's guns from the beginning to the end of every game all season long. Consistency is all we ask.

posted by camcanuck at 01:40 PM on June 08, 2004

I don't think I'll listen to YOUR opinions about the hockey gods what with your support of Dallas having a recent Cup victory to reflect upon (on a disputed goal no less, no hockey god love for the Gelinas non-goal in game 6). That's a good policy, but considering that I've spent the last 10 years going from Denver (first year of the Avalanche; they win Cup) to Dallas (two Cup trips, one win) to North Florida (closest team -- the Bolts), I may not know the hockey gods, but they're following me around.

posted by rcade at 04:56 PM on June 08, 2004

so, um, rcade, any chance you'll be moving to NYC anytime soon? Why? So the Devils can win again?

posted by grum@work at 07:00 PM on June 08, 2004

i'd be happy if they'd just make the fucking playoffs.

posted by goddam at 08:07 PM on June 08, 2004

There is no hockey in New York! The Stanley Cup Playoffs: that thing the Islanders get to do for a week before joining the Rangers on the golf course. *rimshot* I'm sorry, and I would imagine I'm wrong, but until someone shows me a photo or some footage of Ference's stick actually hitting St. Louis in the face, I'm going to think that was his helmet that cut him when he went down. St. Louis was bleeding from 2 places after that hit. On his forehead and the bridge of his nose. ABC showed the play over and over and I thought it was pretty clear that he got hit by a stick. You may be correct about the cause of the forehead bleeding, but I'm pretty sure that the stick hit his nose.

posted by NoMich at 10:08 PM on June 08, 2004

You have a chance to blast the little bastard that's been sticking it to you for seven games, you do it. And you get a penalty for it. I hope Ference feels it was worth it.

posted by rocket88 at 08:22 AM on June 09, 2004

I'm going to agree with mkn on this one as well. It was a marginal high stick at best, but otherwise it was textbook hit. And yes you do want to level St. Louis into the boards because while he is laying there stunned you race up the ice with a 1 ( perhaps 2 if Kipper gets is butt on the bench) man advantage and get a scoring chance. If you just push him off the puck he can get right back into the play. That is exactly what hitting is all about in hockey. You just don't hit guys to make them feel a little pain. You hit people to gain a tactical advantage in the play. Bruce Dowbiggin has a good article here (unfortunately it is subscribers only). To summarise his feelings by the letter of the law should that hit have been a penalty? Yes because of the high stick. However is that a penalty in a game were the refs had basically turned a blind eye to that sort of thing all game? Absolutely not. He advocates exactly what 86 said earlier. Stick to the damn rules. No more of this 'let the players' decide crap because that is exactly what leads to these problems. If players had been getting called for high sticking (or for that matter 'charging') all game long Ference may not have even tried that hit. Even if he did no one would be complaining about the call. The best thing the NHL could do would be reduce the discretion the refs have.

posted by camcanuck at 01:15 PM on June 09, 2004

Boy I'd like to be rational and thoughtful about the nature fo the series, talent and whatnot. But instead I'll just say "Fuck Tampa Bay and it's legion of pseudo-fans." There's a reason why playoff tickets were practically being given away up until the finals. That said - the better team certainly won. Calgary had no juice after game 5.

posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 06:54 PM on June 09, 2004

and I didn't even look for this but.... Tampa's Cup parade yesterday had estimates of 20,000 on the parade route and 13,000 inside the arena (which holds several thousand more, hmmm). Not concluding anything, just sayin'.

posted by gspm at 05:06 AM on June 10, 2004

I fully agree that they got beat. Which is the frustrating thing. To quote myself "The Flames came so close but the list of recent losing Stanley Cup finalists is littered with teams that had a good run and have never had another chance. Mighty Ducks of Anaheim (2003), Carolina Hurricanes (2002), Buffalo Sabres (1999), Washington Capitals (1998), Philadelphia Flyers (1997 and heck, it is not like they haven't been considered a contender nearly every year since then), Florida Panthers (1996), Vancouver Canucks (1994), Los Angeles Kings (1993), Chicago Blackhawks (1992), Boston Bruins (1990). The Flames had a better chance than ANY of those losing teams holding series leads after games 1, 3 and 5 and having a chance to clinch at home in game 6. And even that game went to a next goal wins overtime and what better chance can you get? Let alone a second crack at it in game 7?" I lament the missed opportunity (and the crushing loss dare - i say more crushing, albeit less dramatic, than red sox v yankees last october because at least the red sox will be knocking on the door for years to come). Both teams played under the same refs. The Flames had less skill and you might expect that to show in terms of the penalty calls. ok, no arguing with the red sox mystique but in terms of losing stanley cup finalists this must be the worst any team can have felt regarding their defeat in a long long time.

posted by gspm at 07:33 AM on June 10, 2004