August 04, 2010

But he didn't hit it in the bottom of the ninth of Game 7 of the World Series at both Old and New Yankee Stadiums with Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, and Mickey Mantle watching. Therefore, not a True Yankee^TM.

posted by DrJohnEvans at 02:37 PM on August 04, 2010

Shouldn't that say "Yankees' Alex Rodriguez hits 600th* career home run"?

posted by Demophon at 03:25 PM on August 04, 2010

Yankees' Alex Rodriguez hits 600th* career home run

posted by irunfromclones at 04:06 PM on August 04, 2010

Will A-Rod be the last Club 600 member?

Yes, he will. Just like Nolan Ryan Roger Clemens Greg Maddux Tom Glavine Randy Johnson was the last 300 win pitcher.

posted by grum@work at 05:04 PM on August 04, 2010

In addition to the youngest, A-Roid is also the douchiest to reach 600 HR. Congrats, you steroid-ingesting, woman-hipped, whiny ass mutt!

posted by The_Black_Hand at 06:20 PM on August 04, 2010

ARod may be the youngest, but Ruth reached 600 in fewer games; and that includes spending the first part of his career primarily as a pitcher in the deadball era and having seasons with 8 fewer games a year. Not sure how many games the other 600 HR members took.

posted by graymatters at 07:43 PM on August 04, 2010

A-Roid is also the douchiest to reach 600 HR. Congrats, you steroid-ingesting, woman-hipped, whiny ass mutt!

I'll second that (*) - congrats, AFraud.

Hurrr hurrr durrr.

Pretty certain they took less PEDS to reach 600 as well.

Oh really?

Willie Mays used "greenies", the PED of the day during his time.
Sammy Sosa has been accused of using steroids.
Barry Bonds reached 600 HR in 2002, and he's been accused of using steroids.

posted by grum@work at 08:37 PM on August 04, 2010

Also been accused of being a bit of a douche. Not such an open and shut case for ARod.

Oh come on, man...don't you remember those Radio Shack commercials he did with Daisy Fuentes? And now you're going to defend him?! You've changed, man...

posted by The_Black_Hand at 09:54 PM on August 04, 2010

Typical Spofite: never happy unless pissing in a punch bowl.

(I'll have to remember this the next time some athlete hits some milestone...I'm definitely not holding up the side)

posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:56 AM on August 05, 2010

And if A-Roid wasn't a Yankee, l_b_b wouldn't have lifted a finger to defend him. You are as transparent as scotch tape.

posted by The_Black_Hand at 12:05 PM on August 05, 2010

Is it that he's just not a Nice Guy?

Yes, I would say that's pretty much it in terms of how baseball fans in general treat him. As you suggest, Sosa got away with a lot worse (as far as I can tell), but did it with a smile and seemed to enjoy the game and be grateful for the opportunity. A-Rod . . . my mother would say, "Blow on the personality meter." The complete lack of affect, whatever its source, is off-putting. Even before he put on pinstripes.

posted by yerfatma at 12:31 PM on August 05, 2010

On the one side, you've got guys like Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, Giambi, and Canseco, who pumped a lot of shit in their asses and completely altered their appearance while breaking records.

Why is it an important distinction that their body changed? A-Rod admitted to using, so obviously body changes are not a reliable indication of steroid use.

posted by bperk at 01:10 PM on August 05, 2010

Why is it an important distinction that their body changed? A-Rod admitted to using, so obviously body changes are not a reliable indication of steroid use.

I'm drawing a line between a smaller group of guys who abused steroids to turn themselves into different (stronger) players, and a wider group of players who used them as a conditioning cheat to keep their bodies from breaking down. Not to excuse either situation, but I think there's a significant difference.

posted by MKUltra at 01:34 PM on August 05, 2010

My own impression is "Big Whoop!", who the hell cares what A-Rod does, since any record he might have is tainted. His pathetic attempts at unethical on-field tactics (knocking the ball out of a fielder's glove, calling for a pop-up while running the bases) are what really sets my teeth on edge. But this piece on why no one should care is much better written than most of us can accomplish.

posted by Howard_T at 03:07 PM on August 05, 2010

A-Rod could single-handedly save the human race and people on this site would still despise him. I still can't explain it. With the exception of his use of PEDs, he doesn't even come close to being a dick in the same category as countless numbers of athletes of the present and past. Knocking the ball from a players glove or calling for a pop-up while on the bases? Find anyone who has played baseball at a high level and never been a victim of those type of acts. His marriage falls apart? Please. There are more high-profile athletes in that category than those who aren't. He comes across poorly in interviews? The guy grew up to play baseball, and, unfortunately part of playing in the majors is having to answer inane questions by asshole writers. I don't see a lot of his current teammates bitching and moaning about him being a "douche" like so many of you, who obviously know him well and spend a great deal of time with him, do. Stop expecting A-Rod's personality, and personal life, to be some huge, positive influence on your own. At the end of the day, all he is really guilty of is signing a gigantic contract no athlete could ever dream of living up to, playing for the Yankees, and doing what Major League Baseball really wanted him to do: Perform at a high level and hit home runs.

posted by dyams at 04:23 PM on August 05, 2010

I think the truth is that 600 homers has lost a lot of context. I don't know how to think about it anymore. A-Rod is an admitted user (who only admitted after it was headed to the press at SI). How much, how often is a matter of some debate. He hasn't failed any drug test. My gut suggests not to include him in the Bonds, Sosa, McGwire category, but certainly not in the "clean" category either. So many of the top guys are from this steroid era, and A-Rod had his best power hitting years in the middle of it when he admitted to using.

It doesn't mean that I don't appreciate his talent, ability, or effort (he isn't a dogger), it just means I have a hard time deciding where he is in the pantheon. But if he never used PEDs, he'd be a lot higher.

And grum, there is a mile of difference between a greenie and a steroid.

posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 05:45 PM on August 05, 2010

I think the truth is that 600 homers has lost a lot of context.

I think this is it. A lot of people don't like Rodriguez. So take away the magic of the number and you're just left with the player, and Arod is not well like by a lot of fans. Nothing to really compete with that (without oohs and ahhs over the number).

And grum, there is a mile of difference between a greenie and a steroid.

Oh no, we've been there. Other than saying an advantage is an advantage, I would guess that a high percentage of players that would pop pills would also take PEDs if they had been available.

posted by justgary at 06:23 PM on August 05, 2010

Oh no, we've been there. Other than saying an advantage is an advantage, I would guess that a high percentage of players that would pop pills would also take PEDs if they had been available.

In intent, yes, it's the same, but I'm talking about the numbers. Numbers from the great greenie era of the 60s-70s don't look much different from numbers from greenie free eras relative to the Steroid era. Steroid era numbers are fucking cartoons. Barry Bonds numbers from his fucking early 40s make him seem not real. Hundreds of years from now, people will assume they are typos, or a disgruntled employee fucked with the archives.

I do think one offers much more of an advantage than the other. Drink a couple red bulls and you've recreated the effects of a greenie. It's an amphetamine. Steroids have more impact than a couple red bulls.

posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 07:12 PM on August 05, 2010

Steroid era numbers are fucking cartoons.

Batting numbers or pitching numbers? Because, you know, more pitchers have been suspended for PED use than batters.

In all the years he's been in baseball, I can count the times he's done something likable on no hands.

Really? Just because you don't want to remember, or because it didn't get enough press?

He gave up his starting position at the 2001 All-Star game so Cal Ripken could play there in his final appearance. It happened during live TV at an All-Star game. I guess it slipped your mind.

He donated almost $4million to the University of Miami to renovate their baseball stadium. Of course, that doesn't jive with his "greedy" personality, being the highest paid player in history, so no need to know about it.

He didn't make a peep about moving to third base when he came to the Yankees, even though he was a much better fielder at that position than Jeter. As we know, he had to do it because that's what players do all the time, give up their position without complaining.

He saved a kid from getting hit by a truck.

posted by grum@work at 10:18 PM on August 05, 2010

Oh come on. What player has gone to another team and demanded that they take the position of an all star that also happens to be one of the teams most popular players of all time?

Not many stars get traded to teams with a star in that position, but many players have complained about being forced to switch positions. For example, how about the reigning MVP being moved to the DH position?

The point is, he didn't make a peep about it.

I wouldn't be surprised if he knew his days at shortstop were numbered.

He was a the reigning 2-time AL Gold Glove winner at shortstop the season before the trade? How many "best fielders" at ANY position think their "days were numbered" at that position the year they win the award? And he was 27 years old at the time.

posted by grum@work at 11:46 PM on August 05, 2010

A-Rod could single-handedly save the human race and people on this site would still despise him.

There is no way a centaur could single handedly save the world.

posted by tselson at 12:30 AM on August 06, 2010

I'd say the point is that he agreed to be paid $275,000,000.00 in "hush," money.

Um, what?

He was being paid that money before he went to the Yankees. They didn't give him that deal, it was the Rangers. Whether he got traded or not, he was going to get that money.

posted by grum@work at 08:08 AM on August 06, 2010

Just because you don't want to remember, or because it didn't get enough press?

Because they didn't make an impression. Aside from the one about saving the kid from a truck and the position switch, they're not particularly memorable. You make a good point on the former, but the latter doesn't seem all that laudatory to me. He switched positions.

I also don't believe he's very likeable, and if he wasn't a yankee, I don't think many would find him likeable either.

I'm a Rangers fan. I wanted to like him when he played in Texas, of course, but didn't find a reason to.

posted by rcade at 09:16 AM on August 06, 2010

No one would block a trade of A-Rod to their team

Completely disagree. He was an arrogant classless douche long before he became a Yankee or was caught using 'roids. I really think the Yankees are the only team that can handle his overhead - salary and otherwise.

posted by cixelsyd at 10:30 AM on August 06, 2010

What, exactly, is the kind of behavior you're looking for here to qualify as "likable"?

I like athletes who don't take themselves too seriously, can interact well with the media and care about their team, teammates and the community. I don't like them to cheat or make a big public show of their own greatness, the way LeBron just big-timed the world with "The Decision." I like athletes who never forget they're just a common person gifted with an extremely uncommon talent. The ones who get swallowed by their own ego, like Jose Canseco, seem like pathetic and miserable people.

I like Tony Romo, who has always acted like it was a hilarious accident he became the Cowboys starting quarterback. He constantly goofs with reporters.

I also like athletes who take losses as hard as I did when I was 12 years old. Clint Dempsey's utter despondency after the U.S. soccer team lost the Confederations Cup last year made me a fan for life.

With A-Rod, I've already said he doesn't seem like the "worst guy ever." There's just not much there I find worth liking.

If I've brought out a few people from hiding who genuinely like the guy, great. I hope you enjoyed his 600th homerun.

posted by rcade at 12:13 PM on August 06, 2010

Not many stars get traded to teams with a star in that position

I don't think you're going to find many comparable situations to going to a team with not only an all star at your position, but the face of the organization, a guy with 4 WS rings.

If you want to give him credit for not demanding short, fine. I think it points more to the fact that he's not a complete moron.

How many "best fielders" at ANY position think their "days were numbered" at that position the year they win the award? And he was 27 years old at the time.

You really don't think he knew how his body was changing? That he was getting bulkier? He looks nothing like the shortstop he once was, and that didn't happen over night.

At the time I'm sure he thought he was the better fielder. But with his body type, and approaching 30, I have little doubt he knew his future was at 3rd (as I'm sure his agent knew as wel), much like Miguel Tejada who is only a year older.

Again, I'm giving credit to Arod for realizing demanding a move to short when Jeter would probably be a longer, better fit (typical SS body, batting stats more shortstop like than 3rd) at the position would be a long term mistake.

I just think it points to Arod being smart about his future more than anything else.

Arod, meanwhile, was (and still is) a much better defensive player- arguably the best at the position.

Arod is not a good defensive third baseman, and no where close to being the best at his position.

posted by justgary at 12:34 PM on August 06, 2010

They didn't give him that deal, it was the Rangers

They (Yankees) did give him that deal.

Which some argue may turn out to be the worst deal ever.

The Rangers were stupid (in hindsight) in giving him the first deal, they still owe him money. The Yankees were the only team who were foolish enough to give him the second deal. No one was going to pay him that money to play shortstop but he could make that money playing third for the Yankees.

posted by tselson at 02:21 PM on August 06, 2010

They didn't give him that deal, it was the Rangers

They (Yankees) did give him that deal.

You were referring to "hush money", in reference to him not complaining about moving to 3B. He'd received the deal from Texas before moving to New York. Therefore, if referencing "hush money", no, the Yankees did NOT give him any.

Which some argue may turn out to be the worst deal ever.

Which, of course, is fucking ridiculous to state and why "Bleacher Report" is a silly site (fan contributed articles). Remember the "Whitey Ford" article that was posted here earlier?

Alfonso Soriano: $132million over 8 seasons - 110 OPS+ so far, and he's already 34 years old

Chan Ho Park: $63million over 5 seasons - 83 ERA+

Vernon Wells: $126million over 7 seasons - 102 OPS+ so far since signing the extension, and he's got 4 more years to go.

Carlos Lee: $100million over 6 seasons - currently putting up an 83 OPS+, with 2 more years to go

Barry Zito: $126million over 7 seasons - 102 ERA+ so far, with 3 more years to go.

Even with his down year so far (which is still better than $18million/year Jeter), he's managed a 140 OPS+ since signing the deal. He was also the driving force for the Yankees to get to and win the World Series in 2009.

posted by grum@work at 06:55 PM on August 06, 2010

Regarding Arod's contract, he's certainly put up great numbers up to now. This year has certainly been down. Don't look for Arod's name. It isn't there.

He's older, has a hip problem, and he's signed through 2017 (age 42?). Maybe he'll continue to put up numbers deserving of 20 million (or more) a year for that time. Or maybe he'll follow what other sluggers have done and slowly lose it while being a below average 3rd baseman. The yankees are the only team willing to find out, and the only ones that can afford to.

The Jeter comparison is a red herring. He was signed as much for him to continue being a yankee, and the face of the yankees, as anything else.

It's just too early to tell, but Arods contract has a chance to be god awful long after most of the contracts grum referenced are forgotten.

posted by justgary at 01:28 PM on August 07, 2010

How is that a good thing? Imagine the fun this winter, when the Yankees sign him to another big money deal, after coming off the worst full season of his career.

I'm not saying it's a good or bad thing. I'm saying that no one in their right mind believes Jeter is worth his contract statistically. And when he signs a new one he'll still be overpaid. He's an anomaly, and it's the Yankees choice to over pay a player simply because they want him to be a life time yankee.

So I don't believe there's great value in comparing his contract with Arods (nor anyone else's for that matter).

I'm not calling Arod's contract a bad one. I'm saying that he's a 35 year old slugger who's an average fielder with a bad hip. He's due 31 million next year, 29 million in 2012, 28 million in 2013, 25 million in 2014, 21 million in 2015, and 20 million for his last 2 years (41 and 42 years old).

I'm saying it has the potential to be a very bad contract for several years, and I'm not sure how you would argue differently.

posted by justgary at 07:46 PM on August 07, 2010

There's an interesting exchange in the Times where it appears you got that quote. I thought A-Rod was joking about the injury, but the paper makes it sound like he was being petulant. The audio sounds like he said it for laughs.

posted by rcade at 10:05 AM on August 08, 2010

How is that a good thing? Imagine the fun this winter, when the Yankees sign him to another big money deal, after coming off the worst full season of his career.

I'm not saying it's a good or bad thing. I'm saying that no one in their right mind believes Jeter is worth his contract statistically. And when he signs a new one he'll still be overpaid. He's an anomaly, and it's the Yankees choice to over pay a player simply because they want him to be a life time yankee.

Why some believe Jeter is not overpaid

Could it be there is a similar argument to be made about A Rod and the attention he draws?

posted by MW12 at 06:31 PM on August 08, 2010