11/21/24
October 27, 2004
World Series Game 4: Red Sox are leading the series, 3-0.
posted by jerseygirl to baseball at 06:38 PM - 112 comments
nice lead-off homer
posted by jasonspaceman at 07:38 PM on October 27, 2004
/Offtopic, but kind of timely with Damon's leadoff HR. I have never been a big fan of baseball. I suppose there’s something to be said for a sport where you can read the newspaper cover-to-cover during an average inning without missing a thing. And I’m always fascinated by the sheer volume of gum, tobacco, cud and other saliva-stimulating chewables that big-leaguers can cram into their mouths. (By the way, is it really a sport if you can eat while playing?) Despite my ambivalence, I always tune in during the playoffs and World Series, because I’d never forgive myself if I missed something historic, such as a game that runs under four hours. But there’s one thing I truly appreciate about baseball: the utter lack of self-absorbed showboaters. If Johnny Damon’s grand slam against the Yankees had happened in the NFL, he would still be pounding his chest, flexing his biceps and standing on home plate, arms lifted to the heavens, soaking up the adulation of Red Sox fans. Instead, he trotted briskly around the bases and headed straight for the dugout, where his teammates exchanged high-fives and went right back to work. Can you imagine if Terrell Owens hit a game-winning home run? During the seven or eight minutes it took him to round the bases, T.O. would have spiked his bat at the pitcher’s feet, noogied the first baseman, moonwalked from second to third, slid in slow motion into home, sprinted right past his cheering teammates and jumped on top of the dugout to throw hidden boxes of Cracker Jacks into the stands. I can see Chad Johnson at the plate, taunting the pitcher after every ball. Dare to throw a strike, and he’d call a news conference to explain how the ump, the pitcher, the catcher and Ben Affleck were in cahoots to unfairly widen his strike zone. Watch Martin Grammatica field a routine fly ball, then leap into the arms of everyone on the field, including the bat boys. What a sight it would be if Javon Walker and Donald Driver turned a double play. Are you ready for the Fenway Leap over the Green Monster? Put Keyshawn Johnson on the mound, and there’d be no more need for an umpire. Keyshawn would call every strike with the flourish of an NFL referee signaling first down while griping at his catcher to throw him the damn ball back already. Then again, maybe a little unsportsmanlike conduct wouldn’t be all bad for baseball. Wouldn’t you tune in to see Ray Lewis playing shortstop when T.O. tries to steal second? From here (registration, use bugmenot)
posted by dusted at 07:58 PM on October 27, 2004
Putting aside the whole Sox history righteousness thing, is anybody besides me finding these games a bit of a bore? I like both teams, but I'm not getting much out of the games. It's kinda like watching a double-A team play the local intercounty squad.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 08:18 PM on October 27, 2004
In a word, no. C'mon Mueller.
posted by squealy at 08:29 PM on October 27, 2004
Yipee! Nixon!
posted by oicnub4 at 08:33 PM on October 27, 2004
This never occured to me until right now, but how much must it suck to paint your entire body in team colors when your team is losing.
posted by Joey Michaels at 08:47 PM on October 27, 2004
is anybody besides me finding these games a bit of a bore? i am. but i'm a yankee fan so my opinion has no bearing. btw, we're retiring the "1918" chant at nyyfans.
posted by goddam at 08:55 PM on October 27, 2004
After hearing about how the Card's fans were "the greatest in baseball" (an insult to anyone from Boston or New York) the only thing I regret is that the series didn't start in St. Louis so the Sox could win it in their own city, with people who actually know how to enjoy a ballgame. Meanwhile, it's the 5th and Lowe has pitched under 40 throws. Incredible. FOX et. al. wanted this to be close, wanted to peg the matchup as fair and balanced, but the fact is, the World Series was over when the Sox won the pennant against the Yankees. I'm praying for a sweep if for no other reason then to end this televised pain and suffering.
posted by Civil Disobedient at 09:08 PM on October 27, 2004
After hearing about how the Card's fans were "the greatest in baseball" (an insult to anyone from Boston or New York) the only thing I regret is that the series didn't start in St. Louis so the Sox could win it in their own city, with people who actually know how to enjoy a ballgame. And have a good ol' down-home riot afterwards. Here's hoping that things are calmer than after the ALCS.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 09:12 PM on October 27, 2004
I agree that this series has not exactly set my world on fire or anything. The AL Pennant race was as exciting as baseball gets, IMO, and would have been even if the Sox had lost. The Cardinals just aren't putting up a whole lot of fight right now. That said, we are talking about the Sox here and things could turn around in an instant. Keep in mind that the Yankees were well on their way until the end of the ninth. I won't believe that the Sox have really won for until they get that last out. However, it only makes sense that they would win during a lunar eclipse.
posted by Joey Michaels at 09:16 PM on October 27, 2004
Whoa. Billy Ray Cyrus Damon had a good catch and slipped there. Now Cards have a runner on 3rd. Sweat.
posted by worldcup2002 at 09:17 PM on October 27, 2004
Well, that was exciting for a few minutes. Lowe seems to be putting a lot of balls into the dirt today. I haven't seen him pitch all that often and I don't recall him doing that all that much in the playoffs - is that typical of him?
posted by Joey Michaels at 09:22 PM on October 27, 2004
I think I just expected more fight out of the Cardinals.
posted by jerseygirl at 09:25 PM on October 27, 2004
I think we all did, jerseygirl. Until the Red Sox came back against the Yankees, I figured the Cards were a lock to destroy everyone else.
posted by rocketman at 09:29 PM on October 27, 2004
Man, is that Damon on fire or what? If the Sox win tonite, the Cards shouldn't feel too bad. They were never really in it.
posted by worldcup2002 at 09:30 PM on October 27, 2004
so can we call youse the evil empire now that you have one (i think?) home-grown player and are beating up on a team that spends about $50million less than you in payroll? :-)
posted by goddam at 09:33 PM on October 27, 2004
Maybe the main problem is that this is the first year in a few in which I don't hate either team involved. 2003 - I hated the Yankees 2002 - I hated the Giants 2001 - I hated the Yankees 2000 - I hated the Yankees 1999 - I hated the Yankees 1998 - etc.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 09:34 PM on October 27, 2004
You sure you want to go there, goddam? Steinbrenner hasn't gotten his checkbook out yet for next season and last I heard, he was mighty pissed. That never works out well.
posted by jerseygirl at 09:35 PM on October 27, 2004
:-)
posted by jerseygirl at 09:37 PM on October 27, 2004
It is telling that the World Series threads have not inspired as many replies as the AL Playoffs. If the Sox win tonight, who gets MVP?
posted by Joey Michaels at 09:43 PM on October 27, 2004
no idea, Joey. I'm trying to not think about it. Derek Lowe?
posted by jerseygirl at 09:44 PM on October 27, 2004
Someone please gag that kid.
posted by justgary at 09:49 PM on October 27, 2004
It is telling that the World Series threads have not inspired as many replies as the AL Playoffs. Yeah, it tells me that there are a lot more Yankees and Sox fans than there are Cards fans. :P Besides, the Cards completely disppeared for this series. In fact, they blew goats, and frankly, it's made for a pretty boring Series.
posted by NoMich at 09:49 PM on October 27, 2004
One of the best thing about the series ending tonight would be that we don't have to hear "God Bless America" again until next season. Especially sung by the guy from Creed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 09:50 PM on October 27, 2004
Why Scott Stapp? Why God, why?
posted by rocketman at 09:51 PM on October 27, 2004
(Also, I never would have asked that about the MVP a year ago - or even a week ago - but I think we're living in a different Sox era as of last Wednesday)
posted by Joey Michaels at 09:51 PM on October 27, 2004
If foulke saves it, he might win it. And the cardinals should lose it for having the ex creed man sing.
posted by justgary at 09:51 PM on October 27, 2004
Yeah, don't they know that SpoFi has a "No Creed" rule? Jebus St. Louis, get with the program!
posted by NoMich at 09:54 PM on October 27, 2004
Mientkiewicz is in. Enter Sandman.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 09:55 PM on October 27, 2004
I'm not bored by the series, but I am a little stunned at how much, after the first game, the Red Sox have dominated the Cardinals. The Cards were the best team in baseball during the regular season, they've got a lot of talent (Pujouls is an MVP candidate, the guy pitching tonight won 15 games, etc.), but the Sox are beating them like (choose one): (a) a rented mule, (b) a red-headed stepchild. If the Sox win tonight, who gets MVP?
Schilling will get MVP. I'd prefer a team award, but he's the easy choice.
posted by kirkaracha at 09:55 PM on October 27, 2004
this is true, jg. but after sobering up from last week and enduring a craptacular birthday weekend which included freezing my ass off (again) watching the the metrostars get beat (again) and having both football teams lose, the fact that the sox are now the "big money championship team" is all i have grasp on to at the moment. i promise i'll let go once george signs beltran.
posted by goddam at 09:57 PM on October 27, 2004
The Cards were the best team in baseball during the regular season, they've got a lot of talent (Pujouls is an MVP candidate, the guy pitching tonight won 15 games, etc.), but the Sox are beating them like (choose one): (a) a rented mule, (b) a red-headed stepchild. c) the big bass drum. I've never been so sure about this "best team in baseball" thing. When you've got limited interleague play, how can you know who's the best team in baseball?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 09:57 PM on October 27, 2004
And besides, it's who's playing the best baseball RIGHT NOW.
posted by justgary at 10:00 PM on October 27, 2004
Compare and contrast Boston and St. Louis. Boston gets Tyler & Taylor, St. Louis comes up with two Christian rockers so far. I wonder who Boston would have picked to sing if it went to 7 games? Yes, that was the past tense I just used. And lil_brown, reports of riots were highly exaggerated, but it sure makes for great TV when your sitting a hundred miles away from the action. Menino should have suggested an alcohol ban for the cops instead of the fans. On preview: completely agree with the "best in baseball" comment. If Boston were in a different league or division, they'd have made the playoffs dozens more times. The World Series ended 3 games ago. This is just batting/pitching practice for the scouts to better evaluate how much the Boston free agents are gonna be worth.
posted by Civil Disobedient at 10:02 PM on October 27, 2004
(d) Alan Keyes
posted by rocketman at 10:05 PM on October 27, 2004
I finally got around to reading dusted's link at the top - very funny and sadly true.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:07 PM on October 27, 2004
*If they win it tonight*... I've got an MVP for the Red Sox right here.
posted by dusted at 10:07 PM on October 27, 2004
Zing!
posted by rocketman at 10:08 PM on October 27, 2004
Wow. How did that Pujols play look? I've just got radio here.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 10:14 PM on October 27, 2004
goosebumps just started.
posted by jerseygirl at 10:17 PM on October 27, 2004
Could have put it away.
posted by justgary at 10:20 PM on October 27, 2004
Pujols' play was pretty damn impressive. I don't have the ability to describe it better than that.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:20 PM on October 27, 2004
Pujols made a very good play. Cabreras just struck out waving at Ball 4 (they would've scored a run if he'd walked) to get the Cardinals out of a big jam in the top of the 8th. Let's see what they can do in the bottom of the 8th.
posted by kirkaracha at 10:22 PM on October 27, 2004
It was a great throw, Dr.JE. There was this convergence of 2nd, 1st and baserunner between 1st and 2nd, Puj was in front, and did one of those "run, dive, catch, falling, twist, look at home, throw... out." The throw was spot-on. He's done a great job fielding, it's just a shame they haven't been hitting as well.
posted by Civil Disobedient at 10:23 PM on October 27, 2004
Why Luna?
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:34 PM on October 27, 2004
Here we go...
posted by dusted at 10:48 PM on October 27, 2004
Keeping the theme of my post from the ALCS... Do you believe in miracles? YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Congrats, Sox fans. Lord knows you guys deserve it. Enjoy it...you guys know better than anyone these things don't happen all the time...
posted by MeatSaber at 10:50 PM on October 27, 2004
Amazing.
posted by dusted at 10:51 PM on October 27, 2004
Got to call my Grandfather. Best night ever.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:51 PM on October 27, 2004
THE CURSE OF THE BAMBINO = OVER
posted by insomnyuk at 10:51 PM on October 27, 2004
Do you believe in miracles?
posted by etagloh at 10:53 PM on October 27, 2004
Way to go, Sox. And congratulations to all the fans. Cherish this.
posted by rocketman at 10:54 PM on October 27, 2004
My grandfather is 87 (born in Hyde Park in 1917) and was laughing with more joy than I've heard from him in the five years since my grandmother died. This is just awesome. I will never forget this.
posted by Joey Michaels at 10:56 PM on October 27, 2004
posted by Prince Valium at 10:57 PM on October 27, 2004
CONGRATUFUCKINGLATIONS BOSTON!!!!
posted by vito90 at 10:57 PM on October 27, 2004
wow. amazing stuff.
posted by usfbull at 10:58 PM on October 27, 2004
CONGRATUFUCKINGLATIONS BOSTON!!!!
posted by vito90 at 10:58 PM on October 27, 2004
Did the Rams' Super Bowl win get most Cardinals fans to finally shut up about 1987 and Hrbek bla bla wrestling bla? Because if not, then the bad thing about this is that they still wouldn't shut up about it.
posted by taupe at 10:59 PM on October 27, 2004
!
posted by drezdn at 11:00 PM on October 27, 2004
Manny Ramirez as MVP? I don't get it.
posted by rocketman at 11:00 PM on October 27, 2004
Way late, but i only got home for the 9th - congrats to all the Sox fans. I only cheer for them secondarily, but I'm still overwhelmed - it's so freaking great. Good night, though! On preview: I like Manny as MVP - works for me. Imagine it was a hard choice though.
posted by livii at 11:02 PM on October 27, 2004
Yeah, I guess it was the 17 game winning streak, but I figured it would be Damon or Martinez. Still, it could have gone to over half the line-up. Thank you everyone here at Sportsfilter. I have to watch the games alone out here and, thanks to you folks, I was able to feel like I was watching it with friends. Thank you.
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:02 PM on October 27, 2004
Sorry "17 game hitting streak."
posted by Joey Michaels at 11:02 PM on October 27, 2004
Congratulations are in order to Boston. Still disappointed by the underwhelming series tho'. Oh well. Next year will be the Jays' year! *sob*
posted by DrJohnEvans at 11:03 PM on October 27, 2004
Congratulations to the Boston Red Sox fans from one of the few Cardinals fans on this board. What can I say? If we were going to lose a world title, it couldn't have gone to anyone more deserving than Boston and its fans. A few thoughts before I go upstairs and cry myself to sleep: * My first thought at the celebration in the middle of the field -- dear God, I wouldn't want to be the poor bastard David Ortiz jumped on. * Tony Womack hitting seventh for the first two games of this series was the biggest mistake LaRussa made. * For fans wondering why Busch Stadium was so quiet during much of the final two games, I think it was shock. We'd gotten used to the bats of Pujols, Rolen, Edmonds and Renteria rescuing one another. Instead, only Albert could deliver with any regularity, and there was no one on base for him when he did. The Cardinal team the nation saw looked absolutely nothing like the one we watched all season. It was kind of like cheering for doppelgangers or something. * Speaking of Edmonds, would someone tell both him and Hector Luna it's good form to cut down your swing with two strikes instead attempting to rip every muscle apart in your lower back? * Alan Embree = God. * MVP = Manny Ramirez. A hit in every game of the postseason, on base better than half the time and even a key outfield assist to set the tone in Game Three. What more do you want? * Matt Morris and Woody Williams are both finished in St. Louis. Paging Derek Lowe ... * Congrats again, Sox. Even I couldn't root against you too hard tonight.
posted by wfrazerjr at 11:03 PM on October 27, 2004
About that celebration on the field...who were those two little kids? They were running around chasing each other between the mound and first base.
posted by taupe at 11:07 PM on October 27, 2004
DrJohnEvans - of course it will be! (Remembers the glory days of the early 90s...won't weep because I'm too happy...) Okay, really time for bed. :)
posted by livii at 11:08 PM on October 27, 2004
I blame Scott Stapp and Jimmy Fallon.
posted by Stan Chin at 11:09 PM on October 27, 2004
cheers to the mother-effing red sox and their fans! taupe, it looked like they were re-filming "fever pitch" scenes. the kids may have had something to do with it.
posted by goddam at 11:10 PM on October 27, 2004
I was waiting for Schilling to smell his fingers after they came out from his armpits.
posted by smithers at 11:12 PM on October 27, 2004
I've never been so happy! Pure magic ;)
posted by justgary at 11:17 PM on October 27, 2004
Did Schilling really mention Calvin Shiraldi?
posted by vito90 at 11:19 PM on October 27, 2004
Oh my God I don't believe it!
posted by McBain at 11:27 PM on October 27, 2004
Message on Nomar's answering machine: "Hi Nomar. It's Destiny calling. I called about 3 1/2 months ago, and you never called back. You know, that game where you sat on the bench and didn't go help put your teammates? Yeah, well, anyway - you should really check your messages more often."
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 11:27 PM on October 27, 2004
clap clap clap clap
posted by worldcup2002 at 11:29 PM on October 27, 2004
Done.
posted by yerfatma at 11:37 PM on October 27, 2004
Did Schilling really mention Calvin Shiraldi? Not only that, but called him one of boston's greatest. And he didn't even mention yaz!! Could be worse. He could have mentioned clemens. Did jersey girl faint? ;)
posted by justgary at 11:39 PM on October 27, 2004
Well, I love that dirty water. Ah! Boston! You're my home! God, that was great.
posted by Bryant at 11:52 PM on October 27, 2004
I've gotta echo the thanks to you SpoFites. These threads have been fantastic. You guys have made suffering through Tim McCarver worth it.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 11:54 PM on October 27, 2004
The Red Sox had the World Series-winning run on the 4th pitch of the game.
posted by kirkaracha at 11:55 PM on October 27, 2004
I'm speechless. This is literally, the happiest day of my life. I watched this from a packed bar filled to the brim with transplanted Sox fans. There wasn't a dry eye in the house, and we were all tearfully making phone calls to folks back home. This is... so... awesome.
posted by hincandenza at 12:11 AM on October 28, 2004
w00t! Go BoSox! Was an especially entertaining game with all the Sox haters in the apartment!
posted by jmd82 at 12:23 AM on October 28, 2004
I can't imagine what this win must feel like for fans of the Sox. My team, the Rangers, only have 33 years of futility, and none as excruciating as a World Series loss. Congratulations, Sox fans. Terrific, historic, legendary, unbelievable win. With that taken care of, let me officially be the first to say in the 2005 baseball season that your team only is good because of your excessive payroll, and if it wasn't for the Yankees you'd be the most hated team in baseball.
posted by rcade at 12:27 AM on October 28, 2004
$50 to the first reporter to get a word out of Bellhorn.
posted by yerfatma at 12:41 AM on October 28, 2004
I can't imagine what this win must feel like for fans of the Sox. My team, the Rangers, only have 33 years of futility, and none as excruciating as a World Series loss. Well, considering they've yet to win a post-season series period... CONGRATUFUCKINGLATIONS BOSTON!!!! I can now hate you next year. Try not to burn anything historic.
posted by Ufez Jones at 01:28 AM on October 28, 2004
The win against the Yankees was historic, amazing, wonderful. This win was a rout. St. Louis didn't deserve to have history made in their stadium.
posted by Civil Disobedient at 01:33 AM on October 28, 2004
Who did deserve it? That other NL team that made it to the WS? As of today, even though the Cards got routed, I would give them a much better shot at being in the Series again next year than the BoSox. Between free agency and pissed off Yankees even the wildcard may be a struggle. Here's hoping Beltran likes Houston better than NY.
posted by pivo at 05:10 AM on October 28, 2004
As a small-town/country boy, I dont understand why people in cities that burn and destroy in celebration of a championship. A woman was killed last week in Boston. Can somebody explain that to me!
posted by daddisamm at 05:59 AM on October 28, 2004
daddisamm: It can usually be put down to police overreaction and/or a few bad seeds effect on a large group of people. Fans out celebrating, being a bit rowdy but no one getting really hurt. Police in riot gear show up and suddenly everyone is on the defensive. Police start grabbing people, lobbing teargas or firing mace bullets and all hell breaks loose. Other times a few bad seeds may be inciting the crowd into hostile actions, often as a cover for their own looting or vandalism. Police showing up would also exacerbate that situation. In a mass group of people it really doesn't take a whole lot to push them over the top, the mob mentality takes hold pretty quick. I've actually seen this happen. In '97, when Arizona won he NCAA Tourney. Thousands of people celebrating, honking horns, hugging cheering. There may have been a few incidents along the way but nothing major. Then the police showed up en masse, and you could actually feel the change from a crowd of celebrants to an unruly mob. Suddenly vehicles were flipped and fires started here and there. It was actually a pretty scary moment, and Tucson isn't really what you would call a big city either.
posted by pivo at 06:27 AM on October 28, 2004
This sums it up for me. 
posted by psmealey at 06:40 AM on October 28, 2004
Of the 36 innings played in the World Series, the St. Louis Cardinals trailed at the end of EVERY SINGLE ONE, of them except one. In that one (7th inning, Game 1), they were tied. The Red Sox didn't even give the fates/history a chance to rear it's ugly head. New Red Sox chant for Yankee players: "Two-ooo Thou-sand!" New Yankee chant for Red Sox players: "Twen-ty Mo-oore!"
posted by grum@work at 07:06 AM on October 28, 2004
Dear Theo Epstein, Welcome to Boston sainthood.
posted by grum@work at 07:11 AM on October 28, 2004
grum, I think we've settled on "YEAR TWO-THOUSAND," per the BSG. Kinda weird how the Sox go from cursed to a team with like the 4th or 5th most WS titles. (Author's note: this claim is based on no research and less sleep)
posted by yerfatma at 07:16 AM on October 28, 2004
Also, thank you Fox for making sure you got one last crass endorsement in with that Jimmy Fallon/ Drew Barrymore liplock. I'd rather watch burn victim porn. I will probably have 500 one line comments like this today in an attempt to empty my head and avoid work. The sad thing is, if I can get to 1000 one sentence paragraphs I qualify for a column at a New England paper.
posted by yerfatma at 07:18 AM on October 28, 2004
What does Fox have to gain by showing Jimmy Fallon giving Drew Barrymore's esophagus a thorough scraping?
posted by rcade at 07:26 AM on October 28, 2004
The win against the Yankees was historic, amazing, wonderful. This win was a rout. St. Louis didn't deserve to have history made in their stadium. That was totally uncalled for. Even though I'm a Cards fan, I'm happy for Boston (still wondering what happened to my team the last four games, but still happy). There is such as thing as being a good winner -- which most of the posters here are, but that one stuck in my craw.
posted by mannocchio at 07:35 AM on October 28, 2004
Fever Pitch (2005) Distributor: 20th Century Fox In their defense, it looks like they probably reshot the scene mentioned in the last graf here, which should make for an amazing film moment. Just didn't need Fox to do any free advertising. I listened to Bud Selig on WFAN yesterday and loved that Francesca was in full demigod-like gravitas mode, grilling Bud on the integrity of the game vs. Leon being interviewed in the stands "WHILE THE GAME IS GOING ON!" (You gotta hear it in Franscesca's voice) mannocchio, I'm totally with you there. Sorry our happiness craps on yours and I hope the Cards win it all again soon (against someone other than us). Bonus points if they manage to do it with Tony LaRussa as manager, because I think that's a degree of difficulty I wouldn't want to deal with.
posted by yerfatma at 07:47 AM on October 28, 2004
That seems to be necessary for a couple of these posters, Mann. Screw 'em. Yerfatma, I believe the Sox now have the THIRD highest total of Series wins at six, behind the Yanks and St. Louis. I have no problem with Boston beating us, and I think the Red Sox were the better team. I just still can't believe the Cardinals didn't even show up.
posted by wfrazerjr at 07:50 AM on October 28, 2004
As a small-town/country boy, I dont understand why people in cities that burn and destroy in celebration of a championship. A woman was killed last week in Boston. Can somebody explain that to me! Well, small towns don't usually send teams to the World Series, so it's hard to call this a "people in cities" thing. There have been several articles on the subject in the Boston Globe, some pretty fatuous and some reasonably insightful. The better articles cited a number of contributing factors, of which I thought the most important was the anonymity factor: people in a crowd that big feel that there's no way they will be held personally accountable for their actions. There was a further problem in Boston, caused by small streets that aren't designed for huge mobs of people. Far too many people were allowed to gather for it to be possible to maintain order; it was predictable that things would get out of hand. And I think there's another factor, which I call the "rowdy occasion" factor, which is where people who normally have higher standards of behavior will act out in certain situations when they're off their home turf. As someone who lived near Fenway Park for years, I had plenty of occasions to observe people who weren't thugs, who probably thought of themselves as good and decent people, behave in ways that they would never behave or tolerate in their own neighborhoods. When they go to the ballpark, they forget for some reason that they're in someone else's neighborhood.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:51 AM on October 28, 2004
While I think the clowns of "Dennis and Callahan" go way too far in suggesting the rowdiness is entirely caused by college kids from NYC, I do think rioting is a Young Man's game and the preponderance of colleges in Boston proper contributes to the problem. wfrazerjr, right you are. Also, is there a better baseball columnist than Boswell? I apologize for the continuing Larry King-style crap, but, say what you want, after salt, pepper is my favorite condiment.
posted by yerfatma at 08:03 AM on October 28, 2004
the clowns of "Dennis and Callahan" go way too far in suggesting the rowdiness is entirely caused by college kids from NYC I'm surprised they didn't insinuate that it was "people from Roxbury."
posted by Mayor Curley at 08:28 AM on October 28, 2004
I'm sure they would have used "animals" rather than "people".
posted by yerfatma at 08:34 AM on October 28, 2004
Hey, I can finally remove yankeessuck.com from my blo.gs list. Whew.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 09:30 AM on October 28, 2004
(from an email making it's rounds this week) The Don Mattingly Curse of the Yankees: 1978 - Yanks win WS against the Dodgers 1979 - Mattingly Drafted by the Yankees, Captain Thurman Munson Dies in plane crash, Yankees begin 18 year Championship drought 1995 - Up 2-0 over Seattle in first Wild Card Playoff Series in Baseball history, Yankees lose 3 straight and miss ALCS. 1996 - Don Mattingly officially retires, Yankees rally from an 0-2 deficit to beat Braves 4-2 in World Series started by a 3-run game-tying home run by Jim Leyritz in the sixth inning of game 3. 1997 - Don Mattingly's number 23 retired, Yankees lose to Indians in ALCS 4-3 after being up 3-2 - Mariano gives up home run to Alomar. 1998 - Don Mattingly has no affiliation with the Yankees, Yankees win 125 games, lose only 1 playoff game and win the WS 4-0 over San Diego 1999 - Don Mattingly has no affiliation with the Yankees, Yankees beat Atlanta 4 - 0 in the WS to achieve a record streak of 12 consecutive WS wins 2000 - Don Mattingly has no affiliation with the Yankees, Yankees beat cross-town rivals NY Mets 4-1 in the WS. WS win streak = 14. 2001 - Don Mattingly becomes a Spring Training Hitting instructor, Mariano blows first save in Playoffs, lose WS to Arizona 4-3. 2002 - Don Mattingly still a Spring Training Hitting instructor, Yanks get shocked by Anaheim Angels in the playoffs...Angels go on to win series. 2003 - Don Mattingly still a Spring Training Hitting Instructor, After narrowly escaping the ALCS with an extra-inning walk-off HR by Aaron Boone off of Boston's Tim Wakefield, Yankees loose WS to one-hit-wonder Florida Marlins at Yankee Stadium. 2004 - Don Mattingly promoted to full-time Yankee Hittting instructor, despite a $194 million payroll, Yankees blow a 3-0 series lead and lose to the "Cursed" Boston Red Sox in the ALCS. The first time a team has lost a series in MLB after being up 3 - 0, the first time the Yankees have lost games 6 and 7 at Yankee Stadium since 1926.
posted by grum@work at 10:16 AM on October 28, 2004
From Boswell: After a certain necessary period of numbness and disbelief subsides, both will gradually become very, very happy and have a parade. Coping will be blissfully simple after that brief adjustment. And, every spring, Boston fans will be delighted not to answer questions about 1918, just as Washington fans will be pleased not to hear, "Will you ever get a team?" Exactly, right on, 100% accurate.
posted by Joey Michaels at 01:07 PM on October 28, 2004
I've been reading the posts all day, but just couldn't think of anything more to say. So many of the sentiments have been my own. I couldn't let the day pass without saying something, though. I think I'm just having trouble comprehending. I always said this day would come, but now that it's here, I just feel kinda numb. Kinda like I'm going to wake up soon. And in a weird way, that, in itself, is a wonderful feeling. Thank you Red Sox.
posted by sixpacker at 02:39 PM on October 28, 2004
It's odd and weird and awesome and great and everything all at once. It's very overwhelming and surreal. ... and amazing. My face hurts from smiling. My eyes are puffy from the tears. I barely slept last night. I wouldn't have it any other way.
posted by jerseygirl at 03:17 PM on October 28, 2004
let me officially be the first to say in the 2005 baseball season that your team only is good because of your excessive payroll, and if it wasn't for the Yankees you'd be the most hated team in baseball. Well, this is one red sox fan who hopes the team spends smartly and doesn't get into a spending contest with the yankees who will surely go through the roof with their payroll. The sox seemed to get a pass from most because of the whole 1918 situation. That's over now, let the yankees spend to the moon.
posted by justgary at 11:08 PM on October 28, 2004
one red sox fan who hopes the team spends smartly and doesn't get into a spending contest with the yankees Isn't that a little disingenuous? It's a perfect New England comment, prefering flinty Yankee (not the team) industry to going out and dumping boatloads of cash on a new squad. We follow the team, funding it through NESN viewership rates, ticket sales and merchandise sales, but you wouldn't want them to outdo the Yankees at their own game because it's unseemly? The truth is I agree with you 100% and I'm really looking for the flaws in my own POV. You happened to make a convenient comment. I suppose, being overly generous to myself, it's because we watched the Yankees win by spending and thought that was unfair and now we don't want to do the same thing. Except the Yankee teams of 1996-2000 had far more homegrown talent than this Sox squad.
posted by yerfatma at 07:04 AM on October 29, 2004
You know how long it's been since the Red Sox won a World Series? About two days. Ahhhh that feels so good.
posted by Joey Michaels at 07:49 PM on October 29, 2004
Yerfatma, I'm not exactly sure what you're getting at, maybe because I'm not from New England. However, I, and others I've talked to, basically didn't care when people talked about how much the red sox spent on players, because 1. we wanted a championship dammit, and 2. the yankees always made us look thrifty in comparison. Now we have our championship, and rumors are the yankees are about to go crazy in the free agent market. I would rather have a smart gm, which we do, and build cohesive teams. I don't care if we're at the 'top' when it comes to spending, but there is limit to where, to me, even if we win the return isn't worth it. I don't think most yankee fans believe it tarnishes anything if they win a world series against a team with half their payroll, and probably most red sox fans don't either, but I do. Besides, you can only spend money on 25 guys, and throwing the 25 highest stat guys together doesn't guarantee anything, as the past few years have shown. And you're right, the sox fans pour money into the team, and deserve a return. How about lowering ticket prices? (yes, I know I'm in fantasy land with that one.) Regardless, it looks to me like they're headed in the right direction, or at least my desired direction. They don't want to pay the luxery tax and they're working on home grown talent. And sure, maybe the yankees will spend through the roof and go championship crazy. I'd rather get a couple I'd be proud of.
posted by justgary at 07:51 PM on October 30, 2004
Please God, for once I want a happy ending (I'm trying to ignore the fact that the most famous HORROR writer of all time is the author).