12/03/24
June 26, 2008
And while we're on the subject of unintended side effects, now might also be an appropriate time to mention that 70s Steelers are are dying off like NYC construction workers in The Happening. If true, that's really sad.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 11:43 AM on June 26, 2008
Gee, and I thought North Dallas Forty was about showing how only the Cowboys were using drugs in the 70's...NOT. No one seems to care because unless you live under a rock, you have learned this simple fact: Athletes and teams have and will continue to use any and all means to get an edge. Legal drugs, illegal drugs, corked bats, stick'em, questionable surgical techniques, sign stealing, practice videotaping, recuiting violations, bribery, flubber....ho hum...another athlete tells us he and his team did/does it too...zzzzz
posted by knowsalittle at 12:10 PM on June 26, 2008
This is a shame but since it was legal at the time I don't really have a problem with it.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 12:35 PM on June 26, 2008
And while we're on the subject of unintended side effects, now might also be an appropriate time to mention that 70s Steelers are are dying off like NYC construction workers in The Happening. If true, that's really sad. It is sad.
posted by bperk at 12:40 PM on June 26, 2008
I had heard or read that Bradshaw was administered legal cortical steroids by a physician. He didn't purchase them from a guy in an alley and shoot himself up in the butt. He didn't travel to Amsterdam and purchase them from an herbologist. He did this legally. And if I'm not mistaken about the difference between steroids, couldn't one find cortical steroids in asthma inhalers? If I'm wrong about this, I'm sure to be informed shortly. There is speculation that steroid abuse could have played a role in some of the deaths, but no hard evidence. It's just as plausible that weight issues were a factor. So I'd say that cause of death is inconclusive.
posted by THX-1138 at 12:41 PM on June 26, 2008
Yes, Ms. Bat, it is true about the Steelers of the 70s. Altho some of the later players are dying too. Justin Strzelczyk is one I can think of right off the top of my head. His mother said he had been having mental problems long before the accident. The examination of his brain (what was left of it) showed prolong steroid use. I guess my heroes have feet of clay. On a side note, the same doctor also examined Chris Benoit's brain, what they could get of it.
posted by steelergirl at 12:48 PM on June 26, 2008
bperk's link is much better. Thanks, bperk.
posted by steelergirl at 12:50 PM on June 26, 2008
Is anyone really surprised by this? And does anyone truly think the '70's Steelers were the only team of their era using steroids? What's really shocking is 30 years later, the NFL continues with a weak policy that really does not provide sufficient penalty and incentive to players and teams to discontinue steroid use. Anyone who thinks today's teams aren't using just as much or more than the '70's Steelers is living in a dream world.
posted by BikeNut at 12:57 PM on June 26, 2008
Anyone who thinks today's teams aren't using just as much or more than the '70's Steelers is living in a dream world. Exactly my point above. Teams are just more discreet. You know some are using, I know some are using, Godell knows some are using, and the owners know some are using. Isn't that almost everyone? Not a skeptic - a realist.
posted by knowsalittle at 01:57 PM on June 26, 2008
My believe, is that properly administered by a Doctor, cortiosteriods are helpful in recovering from injuries. Their use should be very brief and not prolonged nor chronic. I have very recently used a cortiosteriod myself for this purpose following an auto accident. The noted side effect was to make me hyper and very talkative. The use was for 12 days and most of that was a tapering off of the dose. Note clearly these are different from anabolic steroids. Cortico steriods are frequently prescribed.
posted by Fly_Piscator at 03:12 PM on June 26, 2008
But but... what about the children!? zOMG, steroids bad evil awful! No possible value! All teams of the past were pure as the driven snow and only modern players have asterisk stats blaaargh!
posted by hincandenza at 05:23 PM on June 26, 2008
No, sorry. World Champion? Horseshit. I fucking hate this American tendency to say bullshit like that when it's obviously not true. You're a champion in what is, by global standards, a niche sport. Like World Series winners calling themselves world champions. NO YOU ARE NOT. Of course idiots always bring up the "Well they are, because they'd beat anyone in the world anyway"... Which was kinda shot to shit in the World Baseball Classic. Incidentally, fuck Terry Bradshaw.
posted by Drood at 07:06 PM on June 26, 2008
My believe, is that properly administered by a Doctor, cortiosteriods are helpful in recovering from injuries. I'm pretty sure that Bradshaw is talking about something OTHER than cortisone shots. As Haslett says, it was the "evil" kind of steroids. Now imagine if Cal Ripken Jr. announced he used steroids in the 1980s. The internet would explode with the hand-wringing/teeth-gnashing/name-calling. But an NFL superstar mentions it? Barely a notice. Ho hum. Welcome to mixed-messages-land, media representatives...
posted by grum@work at 07:33 PM on June 26, 2008
So everyone is so serious about this pervasive steroids issue that no one even noticed my "flubber" comment? If Disney can make a movie in the 60's about how cheating is OK as long as the "good guy" wins, I thought the reference, no matter how dated, was quite pertinant to the discusion. Ah...well...like I said in my first thread; no one cares
posted by knowsalittle at 08:47 PM on June 26, 2008
Haslett played in Buffalo from 1979 to 1985, and finished his career in 1987 with the New York Jets. Steve Courson, a part-time starter on Pittsburgh's last Super Bowl title team in 1979, has blamed a heart condition on steroid use. Courson has also said that teammates such as Jack Ham and Jack Lambert adamantly refused to use them. So far, I haven't seen the damning evidence. I don't know what Haslett knows about what went on with a team that he didn't play for. From what has been presented for my reading, all I can gather about Bradshaw is that he took legal steroids for recovery from injury and that they weren't anabolic steroids. But maybe he did take the "evil" kind. And I wouldn't exactly say that reaction has been "Ho hum". I've seen this story on at least seven different sources now with much public comment/foment. So everyone is so serious about this pervasive steroids issue that no one even noticed my "flubber" comment? Ah...well...like I said in my first thread; no one cares Seriously dude? Don't let it get to you that nobody took much notice.
posted by THX-1138 at 08:59 PM on June 26, 2008
So everyone is so serious about this pervasive steroids issue that no one even noticed my "flubber" comment? Ah...well...like I said in my first thread; no one cares Seriously dude? Don't let it get to you that nobody took much notice Seriously, I am not really concerned except in the fact that no one noticed the blatant similiarity. 1. Team has no chance to win. 2. Team has opportunity to use outside "untraceable" substance to enhance players performance. 3. Team uses substance and wins. 4. Everyone celebrates winning team regardless of clear indescretions. 5. Victory remains claimed by team even though eveyone, even team members, are aware of the discrepancy. How was this really different than using performance enhancing drugs to win a championship when everyone knew drugs were being used at the time? The lack of a needle? Same story...different decade...like I said...ho hum....
posted by knowsalittle at 09:54 PM on June 26, 2008
Seriously, I am not really concerned except in the fact that no one noticed the blatant similiarity. Between...real life events...and a Disney movie?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:01 AM on June 27, 2008
Don't even get knowsalittle started about Angels in the Outfield. The amount of cheating in that is fucking detestable, and supposedly sanctioned by GOD HIMSELF. It's disgusting, that's what it is.
posted by Adept at 10:35 AM on June 27, 2008
Track athlete (who did not cheat) finds out team member cheated, gives back Gold medal. Will the 70's Steelers (who didn't cheat) start lining up to give rings back?
posted by sportsblitz at 02:27 PM on June 27, 2008
From what has been presented for my reading, all I can gather about Bradshaw is that he took legal steroids for recovery from injury and that they weren't anabolic steroids. But maybe he did take the "evil" kind. I'm not sure where you get the idea that they must have been "legal" steroids. He uses the term "steroids", not "cortisone shots", or "cortical steroids". Is there an article where he makes a point of differentiating between the two types and implies it was one over the other? Players (in all sports) have been getting cortisone shots for years, so I doubt it would be something you'd even bother mentioning in an interview. It would be like talking about how you got massage therapy, or used the jetstream tub to loosen up muscles after a game.
posted by grum@work at 02:58 PM on June 27, 2008
sportsblitz, you'll have to exhume some of them.
posted by chicobangs at 04:07 PM on June 27, 2008
you'll have to exhume some of them. You think the rings are buried too?
posted by BoKnows at 04:33 PM on June 27, 2008
I'm sure it's possible. If I won a Super Bowl I'd want to be buried with my ring on my finger.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 04:58 PM on June 27, 2008
Ahh, the perks of being a mortician.
posted by BoKnows at 05:29 PM on June 27, 2008
Seriously, I am not really concerned except in the fact that no one noticed the blatant similiarity. Between...real life events...and a Disney movie? Yes, between a Disney movie and real life events. Why didn't you copy the five points I made after? Did it make your response seem unfounded? 1. Steelers had not won a single league championship, and especially not a Superbowl. 2. Team has a opportunity to use "questionable, not necessarily illegal at the time" steroids. 3. Team uses subtances and wins. 4. Everyone celebrates team regardless of obvious team indescretions. 5. Victory remains claimed by team even though team members are aware of the discrepancy. Cheating and the knowledge thereof and lack of rcognition by the cheater is the same, Disney or not. CHEATING IS CHEATING.
posted by knowsalittle at 05:30 PM on June 27, 2008
But flubber was used to beat a team whose coaches and players were not very nice. They weren't very polite and did mean things to other teams. And everyone knows that under those circumstances its not cheating to teach the not nice team a lesson.
posted by irunfromclones at 05:41 PM on June 27, 2008
grum, I think when you consider that it's Bradshaw we're talking about, I don't think what he says can be used as a reliable source that could differentiate between different types of steroids. In all honesty it was on a talking heads show that I do not remember just now (I know, hardly credible) Bradshaw was administered cortical steroids (their term). It could all be hooey. But none of us were there. On a side note, grum, it seems that you have a real burr in your saddle for this issue. Feelin' like baseballs been picked on unfairly and the NFL has been getting a free ride?
posted by THX-1138 at 05:42 PM on June 27, 2008
Drood lay off the roids you are getting a little bit "out of control". plus what did any of you ranting have to do with the article. For one thing steroids were not illegal back in the 70's, as for the side effects and premature deaths ( lyle alzado is one prominent name that comes to mind) look at all the players that have died before they were 60 years old and that might give you an idea of the effects of steroids. As for Jim Haslett's excerpt I would have liked to have read the whole article because it sounds like he was trying to compliment the NFL on how they are trying to get rid of steroids.
posted by blue and gold forever at 06:03 PM on June 27, 2008
Are we really debating the movie Flubber in this thread?
posted by dirigibleman at 06:05 PM on June 27, 2008
Are we really debating the movie Flubber in this thread?+ No, the similiarity.....I assume you can read by your posting. Let me surmise: "cheating is cheating". It seems a little sad to me that I had to explain this to you. You seem intelligent. Do you get it now?
posted by knowsalittle at 06:20 PM on June 27, 2008
Feelin' like baseballs been picked on unfairly and the NFL has been getting a free ride? It's a weird combination of that and the notion that football/NFL is now "America's Sport". If it IS the new "America's Sport", how come it doesn't get the attention that baseball does when a player does something wrong? How come any time a baseball player gets accused of using P.E.D.s, it's top-notch news for days in a row, but when whole teams of players in the NFL are accused (or even individuals) Can you imagine the uproar if the team doctor for the Chicago Cubs plead guilty to prescribing and supplying illegal P.E.D.s to large portions of the team? It would be front-page news. This stuff? Barely touched by the mainstream media, and relegated to tittering speculation on very specific blogs. I guess it comes down to the fact that people really don't care about the NFL as much as they think they do. Watch it? Sure. Care? Maybe not.
posted by grum@work at 09:26 PM on June 27, 2008
bperk- great link. I have been tempted by steroids, but glad I have always resisted. Hopefully it will pay off with a longer, safer, more productive life.
posted by MMAFighter/Coach at 12:44 AM on June 28, 2008
you know, knowsalittle, i think your comparison - besides being absolutely, from-another-planet absurd - fails on a pretty fundamental level. That being, in _flubber_, they are essentially using a technological innovation to improve the performance of equipment. This isn't cheating, this is just sport: golf, tennis, football, hockey, marathoning and on and on - the entire landscape of the competition is constantly changed by improvements to gear. This is something fundamentally different from using controlled substances to change body musculature, hand-eye coordination, etc.
posted by Adept at 03:19 AM on June 29, 2008
This is a shame but since it was legal at the time I don't really have a problem with it Same can be said about Bonds...allegedly. But but... what about the children!?...All teams of the past were pure as the driven snow and only modern players have asterisk stats... Good stuff and great point. Extremely humorous.
posted by BornIcon at 10:11 AM on June 30, 2008
Same can be said about Bonds...allegedly I have no problem with Barry Bonds either. I can hardly see the merit in bringing up his name in a discussion of steroid use in football however.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 02:29 PM on June 30, 2008
But since it's about football, no one really cares, right?