11/21/24
January 17, 2008
More Bad Noose for Pro Golf: Although the story appeared to be dying down after the Golf Channel anchor Kelly Tilghman apologized to Tiger Woods for her "lynch him" remark, Golfweek has just thrown gas on the fire with its cover story and illustration.
Extremely poor choice of words by Tilghman, extremely poor choice of a cover by Golfweek. Tiger is over it, however, some feel he missed this opportunity to fulfill his prophecy.
posted by tselson at 01:10 PM on January 17, 2008
We managed to not discuss it before, I think that was the right choice. This will not go well. Apologies were made and accepted and I, for one, refuse to let the press incite me into any outrage. If Tiger is over it, I am too.
posted by geekyguy at 01:20 PM on January 17, 2008
Just irresponsible journalism. This was a story worth noting a week ago when it first happened. She was suspended, apologised, and Tiger accepted it. All of those things were reasonable and should have been the end of it. This is a small-market magazine trying to make money by being senationalist, and it's just plain sleazy.
posted by bender at 01:26 PM on January 17, 2008
Seldom does a sequel surpass an original like that...they really went out of their way to be stupid. "We chose it because it was an image we thought would draw attention to an issue we thought deserved some intelligent dialogue." Right. The drawing attention part is right anyway.
posted by chris2sy at 01:42 PM on January 17, 2008
Tiger Woods has taken the high road and let this miscue pass. Sadly we have elements in our society that make a living on race-baiting(Sharpton)and publications that want to follow that example.
posted by sandskater at 01:46 PM on January 17, 2008
DBT: I flopped the story around so the new news was first and Tilghman's apology second. I don't see why this magazine's cover has become a news story. The media covered a provocative story with an eye-catching illustration. So what? It seems to me that some people within golf need to let their foot off the outrage pedal.
posted by rcade at 02:10 PM on January 17, 2008
I agree - I also really didn't the impression that Tighlman was referencing old tyme "lynch" as opposed to a more colloquial use of the word. And I'm a little tired of people who aren't even the subject of the comment getting more offended than the subject of the comment. It's a damn Monty Python sketch. Speaking of which.... "He has a wife you know. Her name is Incontinentia..... Incontinentia Buttocks."
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 02:57 PM on January 17, 2008
And I'm a little tired of people who aren't even the subject of the comment getting more offended than the subject of the comment. It's a damn Monty Python sketch. She didn't make the comments to him privately. She made them on television. I fail to see why Tiger should be the sole arbiter of what is offensive on television. If someone on tv suggested knocking off a female athlete by raping her, I don't think only that one athlete gets to decide if that comment is a non-issue. Further, Tiger is remarkably obtuse when it comes to race. He and Sharpton are probably on opposite extremes when it comes to what is offensive and neither are useful benchmarks. What Tilghman said showed quite a bit of insensitivity. Maybe there is some colloquial use of the word lynch used everyday that I am just unfamilar with. Maybe Tiger is right and there was no ill-intent. Who cares? She talks to a large public audience for a living and this comment revealed major ignorance. I hope she endeavors to learn why her comments received the reaction they did. I don't know how to judge if the noose was a good or bad idea without knowing the content of the article. Is it a fluff piece with an image just to sell magazines? Is it an article that goes more in-depth than just talking about this incident, but putting this incident in its historical context? I'm quite sure the outrage has more to do with folks not wanting to shine that kind of light on golf than on folks really being offended by the image of a noose.
posted by bperk at 03:12 PM on January 17, 2008
As a long time sufferer of IBS, I hope you know how insensitive I find that, Weedy. Or, rather, how sensitive I find that.
posted by Joey Michaels at 03:12 PM on January 17, 2008
We have another reason not to buy Golfweek!!!
posted by Fly_Piscator at 03:47 PM on January 17, 2008
Tilhgman's choice of wording was marginal. Golfweek's choice of a cover is infuriating. Yet's see now. Taxes up. Gas prices up. Discretionary income down. One magazine subscription must go. That would be Golfweek.
posted by BlindAlvin at 04:57 PM on January 17, 2008
That's cool rcade. I'm still trying to figure out how to do some things when posting.
posted by dbt302 at 06:08 PM on January 17, 2008
“If someone on tv suggested knocking off a female athlete by raping her, I don't think only that one athlete gets to decide if that comment is a non-issue.” Are we assuming that the term “lynching” is used to describe something that was done only to African Americans? It seems to me that there are people in our society that make their living splitting hairs in an effort to point out the presence of racial innuendo even when they are not there. Maybe Tiger simply shrugged it off because he is not one of the people in society that goes out of his way to find ill wishes in someone’s words. lynch (v.) 1835, from earlier Lynch law (1811), likely named after William Lynch (1742-1820) of Pittsylvania, Va., who c.1780 led a vigilance committee to keep order there during the Revolution. Other sources trace the name to Charles Lynch (1736-96) a Virginia magistrate who fined and imprisoned Tories in his district c.1782, but the connection to him is less likely. Originally any sort of summary justice, especially by flogging; narrowing of focus to "extralegal execution by hanging" is 20c. Lynch mob is attested from 1838. The surname is either from O.E. hlinc "hill" or Ir. Loingseach "sailor."
posted by amigo59 at 06:17 PM on January 17, 2008
Are we assuming that the term “lynching” is used to describe something that was done only to African Americans? I don't think this is splitting hairs in this context. Christ wasn't the only one killed on a cross, but if you show somebody a cross, they don't immediately think "Simeon of Jerusalem." Similarly, when you think "concentration camp" you don't necessarily think of the Romany people, homosexuals and other non-Jewish victims of the Holocaust. While other people were lynched, lynch has a very specific historic connotation in America when used in conjunction with somebody who is black. Specifically, the murder of a black man at the hands of a white mob. While there are a handful of non-white golfers out there, the majority are white. Suggesting that the rest of the golf field lynch the major black player on the golf field is going to conjure up that specific historic connotation. It would be like jokingly suggesting that the rest of the golfers should "toss [successful Jewish golfer] into the oven." Yeah, you were just think you were making a cute Hansel and Gretel reference, but much of the rest of the world is going to think you've said something batshitinsane. You know, forgetting the racial overtones, why even make a joke about a group of athletes murdering a more successful athlete regardless of anyones color? She could have made the same point without suggesting anyone get killed.
posted by Joey Michaels at 07:12 PM on January 17, 2008
Tiger's only half black, so maybe he had half a mind to pissed off, but the other half let it go. just a thought. The writer was off base making such an obviously insensitive remark. There have been too many recent cases of people using terms like lynching that have been blown up in the press. She was either careless or ignorant.
posted by dviking at 07:36 PM on January 17, 2008
He denied the cover was an attempt to sell more magazines, noting that Golfweek is 99 percent subscriptions. Ya, he should have put a guy in a sheet and a burning cross in background. Then, I would say he was trying to sell more magazines. Ladies and gentlement, I give you today, Journalism 101
posted by Nakeman at 08:16 PM on January 17, 2008
Tiger is over it, however, some feel he missed this opportunity to fulfill his prophecy. posted by tselson at 1:10 PM CST on January 17 I read the prophecy article and feel that it is the author of the article that misses the point. The USA will never get past race as an issue as long as some in society insist upon drawing race into every incident that involves a member of a race saying something stupid. A racist is a person that has a constant behavior pattern of large and small negative actions against one or more race. From what I have read about her career, the woman that made the lynch reference does not have a pattern of behavior that would tag her as a racist. Wood is perfectly right to accept the apology and dismiss the issue.
posted by Cave_Man at 11:02 PM on January 17, 2008
Editor of Golfweek: "The furor begs rational analysis." And the way to keep things rational is to put an emotionally charged picture on the cover of the magazine? Kelly made a stupid comment and apologised for it. Tiger accepted her apology with good grace, presumably understanding that one careless remark does not make one a racist. That's the end of the story as far as golf is concerned. The rest of the story should be about the word "lynch" and its connotations in the wider world - a story for Grammarweek Magazine maybe. The comparisons to Jews being thrown in ovens, or women being raped are ridiculous as neither expression exists in the language as a commonly used expression. As amigo59 pointed out, the original meaning of the word, and the meaning it still has to me and perhaps many others, is as a way to describe summary justice, usually dished out by a frustrated mob. I understand how people could find it offensive, but frankly I'm only interested in hearing from them if they've never misspoken or casually used a known expression in the English language without really thinking about what it meant or where it came from. As an example, allow me to completely derail this thread for a moment and point out that last night on a rerun of Top Gear, I saw Sir Cliff Richard refer to himself as a bit of a "berk". Now Cliff is a well known Christian and it's widely accepted that the only offensive thing about him is how inoffensive he is, so I'm 100% sure that in his mind, he's using the word "berk" to describe himself behaving in a slightly stupid way, and that he has no clue where it comes from. The word has a lewd history and in fact is rhyming slang - Berkley Hunt = take a wild guess. Language is a fickle creature. To vilify this woman, or use her comments to spark a massive race row, is disingenuous and I think Tiger's silence is much more telling and dignified than if he climbed down into the bog and started flinging mud around like the guy in that video clip in the first link above (Bob Parker?).
posted by JJ at 04:02 AM on January 18, 2008
The USA will never get past race as an issue as long as some in society insist upon drawing race into every incident that involves a member of a race saying something stupid. A racist is a person that has a constant behavior pattern of large and small negative actions against one or more race. From what I have read about her career, the woman that made the lynch reference does not have a pattern of behavior that would tag her as a racist. Wood is perfectly right to accept the apology and dismiss the issue. I agree with cave man. This issue isn't beating a dead horse, its beating a horse till its near death, reviving it then beating it some more. No one is defending the statment. Clearly it shouldnt have been said, but how many times have you said something that in another context would have been perfectly fine, but due to some circumstance that might have slipped your mind for a moment you ended up with foot in mouth? I did it a couple days ago: A friend had to drop out of college, and (at least for now) give up her dream. Its a long story as to why, but it ends with her being permanently and severely disabled, and without the college education from berkley she was well on her way to. Anyway, when i was asked to join an honor society, i was excited, and wanted to tell my friend who had helped me along the way. I thaught she would also be excited and proud of me. It didnt even occur to me how this would bring up her own depression. That was obviously very insensitive on my part. But it wasnt malicious. The lynch remark was clearly insencitive, but there is no indication that there was malice involved. Racism is the third rail of the american lifestyle. People speek eloquently about how we should be colorblind, but as soon as an issue that might be racially motivated, and is certainly racially charged, we grab that third rail again. in this case it was done to sell magazines. in the case of al sharpton, it was done to keep himself relevant. Has anyone noticed that the only two people in this story who are acting without selfish intent are the woman who said it in the first place, by appologising, and tiger for forgiving her. Maybe we should just look at things from the viewpoint of the people involved once in a while.
posted by elijahin24 at 05:48 AM on January 18, 2008
Golfweek has apologized for the cover and the editor in charge has been replaced.
posted by dyams at 09:33 AM on January 18, 2008
As amigo59 pointed out, the original meaning of the word, and the meaning it still has to me and perhaps many others, is as a way to describe summary justice, usually dished out by a frustrated mob. I find it incredibly hard to believe that Tilghman from South Carolina doesn't know about lynching in U.S.A. since the Civil War. Who doesn't know about Jim Crow? If someone from another country used this word, then I wouldn't even think a suspension was necessary -- maybe just a word to the wise and some required reading. However, the U.S. has a very, very ugly history with lynching and pretending that those connotations don't exist serves no purpose. She should have known better. Here's the article, bperk. I'm not really impressed. I don't see any reason why they needed the noose. The article doesn't even so much as mention why people would be so pissed about her comments. Kelly made a stupid comment and apologised for it. Tiger accepted her apology with good grace, presumably understanding that one careless remark does not make one a racist. That's the end of the story as far as golf is concerned. If that's the end of the story, it is a little disappointing. Tiger has an incredibly thick skin when it comes to racial issues (maybe because he doesn't consider himself black or maybe because he has had to to play in his chosen sport). Given golf's history of exclusion, I would hope that they would be more vigilant in improving this image. But, pretending like all that is needed is a simple apology without any real lessons learned is unfortunate.
posted by bperk at 09:49 AM on January 18, 2008
I find it incredibly hard to believe that Tilghman from South Carolina doesn't know about lynching in U.S.A. since the Civil War. Who doesn't know about Jim Crow? Wait - you find it hard to believe that a golf TV commentator lacks an understanding of US history? I can't understand why people get even remotely upset by middling crap like this. It's okay for TV executives, advertisers and magazines to get all riled up because they're the spawn of all that is brought forth from hell. But the rest of us need to see it for what it is: A bunch of suits worried about selling.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 11:18 AM on January 18, 2008
The comparisons to Jews being thrown in ovens, or women being raped are ridiculous as neither expression exists in the language as a commonly used expression. As amigo59 pointed out, the original meaning of the word, and the meaning it still has to me and perhaps many others, is as a way to describe summary justice, usually dished out by a frustrated mob. See, this might be a matter of language having different connotations in different parts of the U.S. Where I grew up, if you said the word "lynch" the only possible meaning it has was killing a black man. It is possible that where you grew up (and where the reporter grew up) that the word lynch is regularly used to mean any sort of mob justice. America isn't made up of just my neighborhood or just your neighborhood. If you come to my old neighborhood and use the word lynch, you'd better be prepared for some good old boys with white hoods in their back pockets to slap you on the back and say "one of us." So, in other words, your mileage may vary.
posted by Joey Michaels at 12:03 PM on January 18, 2008
I find it incredibly hard to believe that Tilghman from South Carolina doesn't know about lynching in U.S.A. since the Civil War. Who doesn't know about Jim Crow? If someone from another country used this word, then I wouldn't even think a suspension was necessary -- maybe just a word to the wise and some required reading. However, the U.S. has a very, very ugly history with lynching and pretending that those connotations don't exist serves no purpose. She should have known better. Tilghman, eventhough she is from South Carolina, is only something like 30 years old. She was a golf jock most of her life (that seems to be how she first met Tiger, in college competitions). I would bet you that most people under forty years old, regardless of where they are from, know little if anything about the role of lynching in the jim crow south. It is entirely possible that the woman's parents taught her to respect other people and did not explain why they saw that as important, in such a situation, she would not understand the significance of terms that her parents understood all too well but chose to shield their daughter from. I grew up in the south and I know that jim crow history was seldom, if ever discussed because the majority of people were so ashamed of what happened, not because they wanted to forget it. People like Sharpron are professional rabble rousers, sort of like the blonde that shows up on FOX occasioanlly saying outrageous stuff. Such people produce no value for society when all is said and done. All rabble rousers find easy targets to attack, somehow that gives them a sense of importance.
posted by Cave_Man at 12:18 PM on January 18, 2008
People like Sharpron are professional rabble rousers, sort of like the blonde that shows up on FOX occasioanlly saying outrageous stuff. Well, I'm not like Sharpton and I thought the comments were offensive. I grew up in the South, am under 40, and I know about the KKK, rebels flags, the War of Northern Aggression, and lynching. It's a part of Southern culture. On the flip side of people like Sharpton are folks who have never been discriminated against, are in the majority, but always accuse minorities of being hypersensitive -- let's call it pulling the Sharpton card as a way of dismissing the opinions of all people who might legitimately be offended. Those people are just as clueless as Sharpton. I have much more respect for people who take these incidents and learn something like -- now I know not to joke about lynching black people in mixed company.
posted by bperk at 12:39 PM on January 18, 2008
I am outraged! The world is ending! Really, this is just stupid. No one can say anything anymore without someone trying to spin the statement into something far worse than what was said. Shocked that Al S. is not all over this to have her fired from her job. After all, this was a white/black thing (his specialty). I am saddened that Golfweek has nothing better to do then to bring this back into the limelight. Folks - get over it and lets concentrate on more important news items like why Britney Spears does not use blonde wigs anymore!!!
posted by rotflmao at 12:55 PM on January 18, 2008
No one can say anything anymore Take that stinky red herring and remove it to your compost pile, sir.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 01:46 PM on January 18, 2008
First, let me say that I am not excusing what Tilghman said, but perhaps the use of the word "lynch" and all its connotations are truly regional. As Joey said, where he came from the term was exclusive to the historical context. Growing up in the Midwest, we used the word to reference any kind of rumble, mob action, etc. Hell, there was a group of morons in my high school that called themselves the Lynchmob. Now I went to a very racially and ethnically diverse school and no one ever though twice about it. They were all bark and no bite. Honestly, when the story first broke and I heard the audio clip, I thought "big deal". It took a few minutes for the severity of the comment to sink in. I am not a mind reader nor do I personally know Ms. Tilghman, but I truly do not believe there was malice in her comment and she didn't realize what she had said at the time. I find the cover far more egregious and flamatory than anything Tilghman said.
posted by willthrill72 at 04:39 PM on January 18, 2008
War of Northern Aggression Help a Canadian learn about American history. Did this war take place around the same time as the American Civil War?
posted by tommybiden at 06:39 PM on January 18, 2008
tommy, below the Mason-Dixon Line, The American Civil War is often referred to as The War of Northern Aggresion. It's a viewpoint thing. Often used by people featuring "Forget, Hell!" license plates, and happily flying Confederate flags outside their homes and from their trucks.
posted by The_Black_Hand at 06:53 AM on January 19, 2008
I will point out that when Rocky and Bullwinkle replayed the War of Northern Aggression on the fields of Wattsamatta U and the South won, the veteran attached to the team then felt it was ok to call it "The Civil War".
posted by yerfatma at 08:25 AM on January 19, 2008
The_Black_Hand: Lifetime southerner here. I would not say one "often" hears that spoken at all.
posted by Adept at 08:55 AM on January 19, 2008
Another story I just read says this week's Golfweek magazine has a picture of a noose on the cover. Kind of extreme for them to do that, in my opinion.