12/18/24
May 09, 2010
Athletics' Dallas Braden throws perfect game against Tampa Bay Rays: Perhaps Dallas Braden is the type of guy who just needs to rile himself up in order to succeed.
Interestingly enough Gabe Kapler was the last man out during Buehrle's perfect game.
Dallas Braden my SpoFi Fantasy Team salutes you.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 06:35 PM on May 09, 2010
Damn. 107 pitches, 77 strikes. Pretty impressive stuff, for sure.
posted by Ufez Jones at 06:43 PM on May 09, 2010
Very impressive indeed. He seems to feed of aggression, which got the best of him in his ridiculous and continued tantrum agains Arod, but it seemed to do him well here.
I thought the one annoying part of Arod's response and those that defended him was the 'who the hell does Braden think he is how dare he even look into Arods eyes / what has he done to be able to question the great Arod?' angle.
Well, here's one of only 19 perfect games in the history of MLB. Damn good response.
posted by justgary at 06:58 PM on May 09, 2010
I think the Rays' dougout was on the first-base side for this game. That would make it hard for any Rays to cross the mound. Maybe on a fly ball, one of them could have ran around toward second and crossed near the mound.
Of course, crossing the mound, messing with a pitcher while he's pitching a perfect game, and taking A-Rod's side would break at least three unwritten rules.
Congrats to Dallas Braden.
posted by Aardhart at 08:47 PM on May 09, 2010
It seems Braden's polite attitude may be inherited. ;)
posted by grum@work at 09:26 PM on May 09, 2010
I'd say that bought him more than another 15 minutes. Well done.
posted by tselson at 10:11 PM on May 09, 2010
It seems Braden's polite attitude may be inherited. ;)
Apple don't fall far from the tree.
It seems unlikely that Braden's going to get his coat pulled by anyone in his own family, but perhaps some well-meaning person will give him the clue that he should stop running his mouth and let his pitching arm do the talking for him.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 10:39 PM on May 09, 2010
Is there a well-meaning person that will give "arod" a clue to quit running his mouth, as well? Or, is he allowed to be a dick because he has more than a handful of wins?
posted by tselson at 11:31 PM on May 09, 2010
Can he call it his mound now?
posted by boredom_08 at 12:18 AM on May 10, 2010
The shot of Braden hugging his mom after the game was particularly nice, I thought.
posted by The_Black_Hand at 12:35 AM on May 10, 2010
The shot of Braden hugging his mom after the game was particularly nice, I thought.
That was actually his grandmother. His mother died of cancer when he was in high school. But yeah, it was a nice moment.
Is there a well-meaning person that will give "arod" a clue to quit running his mouth, as well? Or, is he allowed to be a dick because he has more than a handful of wins?
Arod is a misunderstood SUPERSTAR and hated only because people are jealous of the money he makes. You missed the memo.
posted by justgary at 12:57 AM on May 10, 2010
Is there a well-meaning person that will give "arod" a clue to quit running his mouth, as well? Or, is he allowed to be a dick because he has more than a handful of wins?
What?
Quick reminder of the timeline here:
ARod runs back to first base, crossing over the mound.
Braden seethes until the inning ends, and then yells at ARod.
Braden then goes off on ARod (making unflattering statements) to the press after the game.
Press runs to ARod for a comment. He says one sentence, taking a subtle shot back at Braden.
Everyone freaks out, but moves on a couple days later.
Then Braden goes off on ARod again in an interview.
Press runs to ARod for a comment. Another one sentence response, taking another subtle shot at Braden.
Explain to me how ARod was "running his mouth"?
In each case, it was Braden that was braying like a donkey.
(on the field, after-game interview, much later interview)
When ARod says stupid things, call him out on it.
But in this case, he's not the one "running his mouth".
posted by grum@work at 01:27 AM on May 10, 2010
Quick reminder of the timeline here:
I think Braden was in the wrong and did himself a disservice by continuing to run his mouth. But I think the irony is that Arod has had problems on and off the field for years and I believe he was referring to that when he commented today that "I've learned in my career, it is much better to be recognized for all the great things you do on the field".
He says one sentence, taking a subtle shot back at Braden.
His comment: "I'd never quite heard that. Especially from a guy that has a handful of wins in his career ... I thought it was pretty funny actually."
Was not subtle at all.
Change Dallas Braden to Roger Clemens and we're talking about his intensity and gamesmanship.
posted by justgary at 02:06 AM on May 10, 2010
First, he publicly challenged Alex Rodriguez, who ran across the mound during a game Braden was pitching. People had different views about how egregious the run-across really was -- some think it's an obvious baseball blasphemy, others never heard of the rule -- but in the end, the larger point probably had nothing to do with A-Rod at all. The larger point was probably about a 26-year-old pitcher with limited major league success calling out the highest-paid player in baseball for daring to tread on his mound. That's what he called it. HIS MOUND. Some people mocked it -- Derek Jeter said, "It's not like he brought it from home" -- and some people respected it, but nobody could ignore it. Yes, Alex Rodriguez had more postseason extra-base hits than Braden had career victories. Yes, Alex Rodriguez had made about 250 million more dollars than Braden in salary. But the kid was not backing down.
Pretty awesome story.
And I love Jeter's comment.
posted by justgary at 02:54 AM on May 10, 2010
As Gary said, A-Rod's shot wasn't subtle at all. But the guy with a "handful of wins" is now in one of baseball's most-exclusive and revered clubs. Anyone who has ever been put in their place by a big shot ought to be able to appreciate what Braden did.
posted by rcade at 07:17 AM on May 10, 2010
And I love Jeter's comment.
Yeah, that's funny. ARod should pay Jeter money to tell him what to say.
What's with the no-hitters against the Rays? I haven't been able to appreciate the last two.
posted by bperk at 08:00 AM on May 10, 2010
By the way, I guess unwritten rules can be broken (and commented on) depending on who does the "breaking". When it's ARod, everyone gets a free shot to criticize him and determine that he's disrespectful.
But when it's another player, and he isn't as "notorious" as ARod, then no one gives a damn.
What am I talking about?
In today's perfect game, Evan Longoria broke the "unwritten rule" of trying to bunt for a base hit while a player is in the middle of a no-hitter.
Evan Longoria tried to bunt against Braden leading off the fifth, drawing boos from the small crowd.
Think I'm joking about it being an "unwritten rule"?
Curt Schilling's no-hitter broken up by a bunt single.
On Sunday, little changed. Brenly, a former big league catcher, still contended that Davis' bunt was "chicken."
But he said it falls into one of the many gray areas in those "unwritten rules" that players and managers love to quote.
Where is the outrage from Braden? Where is the chastising from the media towards Longoria?
posted by grum@work at 08:44 AM on May 10, 2010
His comment: "I'd never quite heard that. Especially from a guy that has a handful of wins in his career ... I thought it was pretty funny actually."
Was not subtle at all.
Really? I see no name-calling. I see no swearing. I see no ranting. He doesn't even say Braden's name.
I can't say the same thing about Braden's actions.
BTW, when Braden gave his grandmother a hug, she was smart to wait until he got to the dugout:
posted by grum@work at 08:49 AM on May 10, 2010
I don't know how misunderstood A. Rodriguez is. There is obviously a quality side to the guy that we get to see glimpses of now and then. It's not like's he's all one thing or another.
He's just got different facets to his personality. But he does have a tendency to do petty bush league things that would be questionable no matter who was doing them.
I guess the salary magnifies everything, but I don't think of his salary first and foremost anymore. So many players are making such obscene amounts of money - it's all virtually imaginary at this point.
Plus, it's not his fault that Tom Hicks is an ass and got all senseless with his bank account when Scott Boras came knocking at the door way back when.
Rodriguez seems to feel the pressure of the contract and maybe would even be willing to make less money if he could just be the great player that he is and go out and produce and have the salary be a non-issue. To me, his delight in the Yankees' run last year and his ability to contribute to it seemed genuine and heartfelt.
And he did have a moment where he seemed to truly question the worth of Boras' existence on earth. That counts for a check mark in the plus column, however fleeting.
posted by beaverboard at 08:52 AM on May 10, 2010
Evan Longoria tried to bunt against Braden leading off the fifth, drawing boos from the small crowd.
I've at least heard of that unwritten rule (as opposed to the one about running across the mound). That said, at what point is a perfect-game-in-the-making recognized? Is it foul to bunt your way on to lead off the second inning? I would say that the 5th inning still has a lot of baseball to be played, especially with a lead of 4 runs. You gotta try to do what you can to get on the board.
posted by bender at 09:38 AM on May 10, 2010
Grum: For an All Star like A-Rod to say that Braden has a "handful of wins" is a shot in the mouth. A comment doesn't have to have profanity to be harsh.
Braden acted like an idiot by taking the dispute as far as he did, and the stuff he says about his area code is embarrassing. But I appreciate how he responded to being big-timed by A-Rod.
posted by rcade at 09:49 AM on May 10, 2010
Where is the outrage from Braden? Where is the chastising from the media towards Longoria?
If it had worked I bet we'd be hearing all about it. However, for most of the people who didn't watch the game and have only heard about the end result Longoria's attempt isn't even mention. Quite frankly it is irrelevant.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 09:59 AM on May 10, 2010
Where is the outrage from Braden?
Didn't see this earlier. Can you recall a pitcher who threw a perfect game complaining afterwards about a bunt-hit attempt during the game? It's like a World Series victor interrupting the champagne celebration to complain about a blown call.
posted by rcade at 10:28 AM on May 10, 2010
Obviously there's no hard and fast rule for not bunting your way on to break up a perfect game (or leaning into a pitch or trying to create a catcher's interference call, for that matter), but people booing Longoria for trying it in the fifth inning of a relatively close game are morons.
Most of these rules -- aside from the one I'mARod broke -- are influenced by the situation. Tight game early in the season or when postseason berths are in play? You do what you can do to get on base. Blowout or late-season yawner? Not so much.
When it's ARod, everyone gets a free shot to criticize him and determine that he's disrespectful.
That's because he's done enough questionable stuff in his career to earn the criticism. Hopefully, it will also earn him a fastball to the middle of the back in early July.
posted by wfrazerjr at 11:32 AM on May 10, 2010
Where is the outrage from Braden?
Didn't see this earlier. Can you recall a pitcher who threw a perfect game complaining afterwards about a bunt-hit attempt during the game?
I assumed that since it happened while he was on the mound, he would have glared at Longoria real hard, then yelled at him when he headed back to the dugout. That seems to be his standard operating procedure.
Hopefully, it will also earn him a fastball to the middle of the back in early July.
If Braden does drill ARod in the back the next time they meet, then all it proves is that ARod was right; Braden just wants his 15 minutes of fame.
posted by grum@work at 12:27 PM on May 10, 2010
the guy with a "handful of wins" is now in one of baseball's most-exclusive and revered clubs
Quite correct. For years to come Braden's achievement will be mentioned each time a pitcher flirts with a perfect game.
Think anyone will care what Arod said then? Hope Aroid enjoys his 15 minutes of fame.
posted by cixelsyd at 12:29 PM on May 10, 2010
I was at the A's-Rays game! On Saturday. D'oh.
posted by kirkaracha at 12:30 PM on May 10, 2010
Think anyone will care what Arod said then? Hope Aroid enjoys his 15 minutes of fame.
Oh, I see what you did there. You conflated ARod with steroids!
Oh, jolly good pun!
In actuality, ARod's "15 minutes of fame" will probably last 1000 times longer than Braden's.
Braden's name will probably be as well remembered with greats like Mike Witt, Charlie Robertson and Len Barker.
posted by grum@work at 12:40 PM on May 10, 2010
True, but Len Barker is remembered. That's huge. Even if Braden has a journeyman career, he'll be able to do autograph shows forever. Or at least until he flips his lid and shows somebody how they do things "in the 209."
posted by rcade at 12:57 PM on May 10, 2010
If Braden does drill ARod in the back the next time they meet, then all it proves is that ARod was right; Braden just wants his 15 minutes of fame.
Really? To me it would prove Braden and the A's aren't the kind of weak-willed weiners that will put up with the kind of horseshit Rodriguez seems to deal in.
The Jays should have hit him in every game after the Howie Clark stunt.
posted by wfrazerjr at 01:13 PM on May 10, 2010
Really? To me it would prove Braden and the A's aren't the kind of weak-willed weiners that will put up with the kind of horseshit Rodriguez seems to deal in.
The A's? I don't think there is anyone else on the team that gave a damn about what ARod did that day, except Braden. None of them were yelling at him on the field. Anything they said in the lockerroom after the game (or later) was strictly to stick up for their teammate.
And how about this for more horseshit from ARod:
"As I learned in my career, it's always much better to be recognized for some of the great things you do on the field," Rodriguez said from the visitors' dugout at Fenway Park, as the Yankees took batting practice."
"You know, good for him. He threw a perfect game," A-Rod said. "And even better, he beat the Rays."
What a bastard!
The Jays should have hit him in every game after the Howie Clark stunt.
Oh, give me a break. I'm a die-hard Blue Jays fan, and even I know that the rookie got schooled on that one.
I don't remember people going ballistic when Chuck Knoblauch (fielder) faked out Lonnie Smith (runner) in the 1991 World Series, so why can't the runner fake out the fielder?
posted by grum@work at 01:39 PM on May 10, 2010
Really? I see no name-calling. I see no swearing. I see no ranting. He doesn't even say Braden's name.
Well, maybe we have different meanings for subtle. Arod was certainly more polite with his response, but I think it was pretty clear he was calling Braden a nobody.
Again, I think Braden went way overboard with his response. And after his barrage of insults against Arod I don't blame Arod for wanting to get a jab back at him.
After reading his story I think the 'me against the world' attitude probably did him some good. He just needs to grow up a little and learn where to use it and how much.
posted by justgary at 01:39 PM on May 10, 2010
Really? To me it would prove Braden and the A's aren't the kind of weak-willed weiners that will put up with the kind of horseshit Rodriguez seems to deal in.
Maybe it's that guy thing that I just don't get, but somehow I just don't see why throwing a baseball at someone else as hard as you can, with the intention of hitting them -- over an action that had absolutely no consequences except in the mind of chronologically adult adolescents who feel like they were dissed -- is less than antisocial, at the very least. So why do so many baseball fans not only think this is okay, but actively encourage pitchers to do it and equate an unwillingness to commit a deliberate act that could seriously hit another human being with not having a stiff (or big) enough penis?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 02:15 PM on May 10, 2010
So why do so many baseball fans not only think this is okay, but actively encourage pitchers to do it and equate an unwillingness to commit a deliberate act that could seriously hit another human being with not having a stiff (or big) enough penis?
Do you not watch baseball?
Men, in skin tight pants, swing large, wooden, phallic symbols at waist height, in an attempt to hit an object as hard as they can.
And when those "batters" are struck by a pitch, what is the first thing they do? They point those large, wooden, phallic symbols right at the head of the "pitcher" while yelling at them.
posted by grum@work at 02:23 PM on May 10, 2010
The quote of the day (on Mothers' Day, no less) came from Branden's grandmother:
"The way things unfolded, the bigger story is with his mom and with his grandmother," said the A's longest serving player, Eric Chavez. "The headline is the special day with his grandmother."
But the fact is that for the national media, Braden's pitching feat will be a great excuse to replay the drama of a little-known A's player's war of words with perhaps baseball's most famous player.
His grandmother at first agreed with Chavez that it's time to move past the Rodriguez business.
"I'm thinking, 'Let's forget it, let's forget it,' " Lindsey said.
But then she paused and said, "Stick it, A-Rod."
posted by Howard_T at 03:39 PM on May 10, 2010
Not all of them wear skin tight pants, grum. Way too many of them wear those softball pants.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 04:06 PM on May 10, 2010
I don't think there is anyone else on the team that gave a damn about what ARod did that day ...
Why would you think that? Any time an unwritten rule comes up, there's no shortage of current and former ballplayers who speak up for them. My wild guess is that there are probably 3-5 keepers of the unwritten rulebook on each team, most of them on the far side of 30.
I like A-Rod's comment about Braden's perfect game. That was classy.
posted by rcade at 04:10 PM on May 10, 2010
*sigh*
Part of being a competitive is sticking up for your teammates. When one of you is wronged, all should have the same desire to correct the wrong, or at least make the wrongdoer (almost said evildoer there, thanks, Dubya) aware of his or her actions and somewhat accountable.
A team which allows such transgressions without response give the opposition a psychological and tactical advantage. Granted, in baseball there are fewer direct physical confrontations, but a few I can think of would be rolling the shortstop/second baseman on the double-play turn, planting the catcher and most importantly, throwing inside.
The last can be deadly. A weak team can expect plenty of chin music, and if your own pitchers don't do the same, it's not going to stop. It's a quick ticket to lots of strikeouts and weak pop-ups.
As for a fastball in the back, do you think a professional pitcher is so unskilled as to not be able to nail a hitter pretty much wherever he wishes? You make it sound as if it's pistols at dawn.
ARod's little jaunt across the mound could be chalked up to stupidity, except he's a repeat offender for making the little gamesmanship maneuvers. I don't fault him for it at all, but I do take exception to his feigned ignorance.
If he wants to break those rules, good for him. Just don't act like a tool when the aggrieved calls you on it in the fashion he sees fit.
And Grum, I'm pretty sure you're watching Project Runway again.
posted by wfrazerjr at 04:15 PM on May 10, 2010
The last can be deadly.
This, I agree with.
A weak team can expect plenty of chin music, and if your own pitchers don't do the same, it's not going to stop.
While this may be true, in the sense of "this is how it is", and I understand about the psychological and tactical aspect, I still find this inexcusable -- the whole playing of this stupid and dangerous game. Someone plunked your guy. Even if it was intentional, is it sane to deliberately throw a ball at someone else in a way that could have deadly consequences? I know I'm in the minority on this, but that has never made sense to me.
As for a fastball in the back, do you think a professional pitcher is so unskilled as to not be able to nail a hitter pretty much wherever he wishes?
Josh Becket sure wasn't putting his pitches pretty much wherever he wished to on Friday night -- unless you think he wanted to hit Robbie Cano directly in the knee. Do you think that's the case?
ARod's little jaunt across the mound could be chalked up to stupidity, except he's a repeat offender for making the little gamesmanship maneuvers. I don't fault him for it at all, but I do take exception to his feigned ignorance.
You "take exception" over attitudes that you are somehow able to read from the guy's mind, but you don't "take exception" to Braden being a blowhard?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 04:37 PM on May 10, 2010
Whatever you think, I think it's his mound now.
I can't believe how much some of you care about this. Or am I confusing it with general boredom?
Why can't A-Rod be a bit of a egocentric moron, and Braden be a spewing blowhard? Why does one of them have to be right? Let it go. Perfect game, people. Focus.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 05:30 PM on May 10, 2010
As for a fastball in the back, do you think a professional pitcher is so unskilled as to not be able to nail a hitter pretty much wherever he wishes? You make it sound as if it's pistols at dawn.
So, just to confirm, you think when players get hit in the head by a pitch, it's always been deliberate?
A weak team can expect plenty of chin music, and if your own pitchers don't do the same, it's not going to stop.
A quick charge to the mound, some scuffling, and warnings from the umpire at the start of the next game will usually stop it, even if the "weak team" pitcher doesn't respond.
I don't think there is anyone else on the team that gave a damn about what ARod did that day ...
Why would you think that?
Because none of them said (or did) anything to ARod when he "transgressed", and none of them had a comment about it UNTIL Braden said something about it to the press after the game.
It gives the impression that they were minding their own business when they suddenly realized their pitcher was spouting off about something. They are good teammates, realized they needed to back him up, and then commented after the fact.
Don't you think the first baseman would have said something to ARod when he returned to the base after walking on hallowed ground, if he gave a damn at all?
If Braden wants to make a mountain out of a molehill, that's his prerogative. If his teammates want to stick up for him because that's what teammates do. And if the press run to ARod to get a quote from him about some pitcher making a mountain out of a molehill (while insulting ARod), then I think it's well within ARod's right to jab back at Braden.
I'm just confused why so many people think what Braden said was okay, but ARod's response was arrogant/assholish/horseshit.
In the 416/905/519 area where I'm from, you don't let someone badmouth you without throwing back a sarcastic/biting response. That shit just isn't allowed, up in here. *flashes SW Ontario gang sign*
posted by grum@work at 05:50 PM on May 10, 2010
I'm just confused why so many people think what Braden said was okay, but ARod's response was arrogant/assholish/horseshit
Because it's viewed by most as just another typical classless Arod posturing and perhaps folks are siding with Braden because of it.
posted by cixelsyd at 06:06 PM on May 10, 2010
Don't you think the first baseman would have said something to ARod when he returned to the base after walking on hallowed ground, if he gave a damn at all?
What they said to A-Rod personally, or among themselves, isn't necessarily what they shared with the press.
I'm just confused why so many people think what Braden said was okay, but ARod's response was arrogant/assholish/horseshit.
Because it's an asshole move for one of the biggest names in the game to call somebody a nobody. That's not how we do things in the 904.
posted by rcade at 06:18 PM on May 10, 2010
Even if it was intentional, is it sane to deliberately throw a ball at someone else in a way that could have deadly consequences?
As a coach, I would never, never advocate throwing at anyone's head -- I guess I should be clearer about that when I say throwing inside. Anytime a ball goes up and in at someone's head in that fashion, you have to guess it's a mistake for a couple reasons -- one, because it's easier to get out of the way of a ball thrown upstairs and two, I don't really believe any pitcher wants to kill an opposing batter (Clemens v. Piazza perhaps excepted).
But I would also say your normal logic goes out the window when you're discussing game strategy. Do I really want to plaster some guy in the back just because it happen to someone on my team? No, I don't -- but if I don't do it for the team, it will most likely keep happening to us. So, the next guy goes down. Josh Becket sure wasn't putting his pitches pretty much wherever he wished to on Friday night -- unless you think he wanted to hit Robbie Cano directly in the knee. Do you think that's the case?
I don't know what the situation was here. Did a Boston player get drilled before this? Or did Beckett just overthrow a pitch and nail Cano? In the former, I'd say no, he wouldn't want to hit him in the knee, but if he was aiming for him, it'd be pretty obvious that he wasn't aiming for his head. Plus, unless you were fooled by the pitch, how the hell did he not get his knee out of the way?
So, just to confirm, you think when players get hit in the head by a pitch, it's always been deliberate?
See above.
A quick charge to the mound, some scuffling, and warnings from the umpire at the start of the next game will usually stop it, even if the "weak team" pitcher doesn't respond.
I'm not sure how to respond to this. I think you're correct, but are you advocating a player charging the mound and starting a fight over a fastball to the back for another guy?
It gives the impression that they were minding their own business when they suddenly realized their pitcher was spouting off about something. They are good teammates, realized they needed to back him up, and then commented after the fact.
I'm not sure anyone else realized what had happened, and I'm sure they weren't as pissed as Braden (I keep wanting to type Ned Braden). I should also clarify this -- I'm not saying Braden didn't go a little overboard. He went a lot overboard.
But I also don't think another player is going to go apeshit. What's the first baseman supposed to do? Punch him out? I think the idea is Braden would handle it himself in the manner we've discussed -- or, completely flip his wig and lead to the entertaining discussions we've had. :)
Because it's an asshole move for one of the biggest names in the game to call somebody a nobody. That's not how we do things in the 904.
I think Braden was stung, and he dropped a nice verbal load on our friend Alex. You may think he's an asshole, and you might be right -- but I think he's not even remotely close to Arod on the jerkoff scale for his choice of words.
posted by wfrazerjr at 06:57 PM on May 10, 2010
How's that, Weedy?
posted by wfrazerjr at 06:57 PM on May 10, 2010
But I also don't think another player is going to go apeshit. What's the first baseman supposed to do? Punch him out?
Who said do anything physical? How about talk to ARod about it? That happens a lot, as I often see the runner and fielder chat in between pitches. That obviously didn't happen because none of Braden's teammates mentioned to the press that they talked to ARod about it.
The only person who gave a flying fuck about ARod crossing the mound, when it happened, was Braden. Period. None of the announcers mentioned it, none of the players mentioned it, none of the umpires cared. Nobody said crap about it, except Braden.
Because it's an asshole move for one of the biggest names in the game to call somebody a nobody. That's not how we do things in the 904.
Really? But it's okay for (at the time) one of the smaller names in the game to make personal attacks on an opponent to the media? Obviously ARod's answer was supposed to get a rise out of Braden, just like Braden's braying was supposed to bother ARod. I just find it weird that the hate lands on ARod when it was Braden who started the shit-flinging in the first place.
posted by grum@work at 07:15 PM on May 10, 2010
But it's okay for (at the time) one of the smaller names in the game to make personal attacks on an opponent to the media?
I've said before that when Braden went back to the subject with his silly comments about the "209" that it was stupid. He went too far with that. But before A-Rod said the comment we're talking about, I don't see any personal attacks here, here or here. It's all respect-for-the-game, unwritten rule boilerplate.
I think Braden was stung, and he dropped a nice verbal load on our friend Alex.
You misunderstand me. I was talking about A-Rod being an asshole with his "handful of wins" comment.
Braden has 209 tattooed across his chest. If they change the area code someday, he's going to take it as hard as the Beverly Hills 90210 kids took the change of the ZIP code on SNL.
posted by rcade at 07:46 PM on May 10, 2010
The only person who gave a flying fuck about ARod crossing the mound, when it happened, was Braden. Period. None of the announcers mentioned it, none of the players mentioned it, none of the umpires cared. Nobody said crap about it, except Braden.
Let me first say that while I would vote yes on this unwritten rule, I'd say it's pretty far down the master list. And I think Braden went way over in his reaction.
But between pitches at that point none of the infielders are looking at the mound or paying attention to Arod crossing the field. I doubt the announcers are watching him cross the field. As a fan I wouldn't be watching it. And I doubt Braden would have noticed if he hadn't been returning to the mound at the exact same time Arod crossed the mound.
I agree that most of the players are probably thinking it wasn't a big deal but simply backing up their teammate, but I don't see the fact that they didn't react at the time it happened a sign of much.
posted by justgary at 08:27 PM on May 10, 2010
Man, Braden must just pace the dugout in absolute anger while the other team is in the field and the opposing pitcher treads on his mound.
I just find it weird that the hate lands on ARod when it was Braden who started the shit-flinging in the first place.
Agreed.
posted by dyams at 08:36 PM on May 10, 2010
I don't see any personal attacks
"The Yankees are an extremely classy organization with guys who always tend to do the right thing every time; it's kind of disheartening to see that not show through or be reflected by somebody of (Rodriguez's) status."
He's saying Rodriguez disrespecting the Yankees/game. That's an insult.
Also, he demonstratively yelled at ARod in public on the way back to the dugout. I'm pretty sure he wasn't yelling "Good play, old chap!"
posted by grum@work at 09:29 PM on May 10, 2010
That's an insult.
"Kind of disheartening" is a pretty mild rebuke. Braden told the press what he yelled at A-Rod: "Get off my [expletive] mound."
posted by rcade at 07:00 AM on May 11, 2010
wfrazerjr:
I don't know what the situation was here. Did a Boston player get drilled before this? Or did Beckett just overthrow a pitch and nail Cano? In the former, I'd say no, he wouldn't want to hit him in the knee, but if he was aiming for him, it'd be pretty obvious that he wasn't aiming for his head. Plus, unless you were fooled by the pitch, how the hell did he not get his knee out of the way?
No, no Red Sox got drilled before this -- there was no provocation whatsoever. It was pretty clear that Beckett just lost control -- in general, not just on that pitch, because he quickly proceeded to hit Jeter as well, and then nearly hit two other batters, I believe all within a couple of innings. After the game, he said something like, "I had no idea where they were going." After Jeter got hit, there was some yelling from the top step of the Yankee dugout, but no "retaliation" from Yankee pitchers.
As for how the hell Cano did not get his knee out of the way, it was his rear knee that got hit. On slomo you can see clearly that the ball tails inside, Cano managed to get his front leg out of the way -- it would have hit that knee, had he not done that -- but I guess in doing that, his weight went onto the rear leg, and that leg didn't move. The pitch drilled him right on the inside of his left knee.
Again, my view is one that I know is a minority one. I think that "retaliating" is a stupid and dangerous game. I think that fans who encourage it and applaud it are stupid. I think that pitchers who do it are stupid. If you decide you want to throw inside to intimidate someone, if you're going to take that deliberate chance, you better be damn sure you know exactly where you can put that ball, and you better hope and pray that the batter doesn't move in some unexpected direction, because outside the batter's box is not your space. I can't even imagine what it would be like to be a pitcher who let himself buy this line of shit about "retaliation", threw inside, didn't put it where he meant, and caused someone a brain injury. I can't even imagine willingly letting your self be put in such a stupid position, but it happens all the time and the fans applaud it. When a five-year-old throws something and hurts someone, maybe that five-year-old can be excused for not knowing the consequences of his/her actions. An adult has no such excuse. Y
posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:44 AM on May 11, 2010
After Jeter got hit, there was some yelling from the top step of the Yankee dugout, but no "retaliation" from Yankee pitchers.
Of course they retaliated. It was in the next game.
posted by justgary at 01:25 PM on May 11, 2010
Of course they retaliated. It was in the next game.
Says the Post. But please, tell me what that has to do with my point.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 02:14 PM on May 11, 2010
Says the Post. But please, tell me what that has to do with my point.
You're correct. Sabathia didn't come out and say he hit Pedroia on purpose. For what it's worth, the article I was going to link to was an espn article (that I can't find), with Yankee players applauding Sabathia for "having their back". You're certainly free to believe otherwise.
But please, tell me what that has to do with my point.
What does pointing out that they Yankees did not retaliate have to do with your point?
posted by justgary at 02:25 PM on May 11, 2010
What does pointing out that they Yankees did not retaliate have to do with your point?
Nothing. Do you want to address my point, or would you rather continue to ignore it and blow smoke?
I'll quote it for you again, so you can read it again. I think it's quite clear what is being said. Would you also like help reconstructing the context so that you can understand why the Beckett example is relevant?
No, no Red Sox got drilled before this -- there was no provocation whatsoever. It was pretty clear that Beckett just lost control -- in general, not just on that pitch, because he quickly proceeded to hit Jeter as well, and then nearly hit two other batters, I believe all within a couple of innings. After the game, he said something like, "I had no idea where they were going." After Jeter got hit, there was some yelling from the top step of the Yankee dugout, but no "retaliation" from Yankee pitchers.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 02:44 PM on May 11, 2010
Do you want to address my point, or would you rather continue to ignore it and blow smoke?
Your only point is that the Yankees are great and no meanies on the other team can ever be right.
posted by yerfatma at 04:16 PM on May 11, 2010
Nothing. Do you want to address my point, or would you rather continue to ignore it and blow smoke?
The thread has gone from Braden's perfect game, to a debate on Arod, to a debate on throwing at batters. I have no desire to address your point or get into that debate. I was simply completing your story, where I thought maybe you had missed what took place the next game. It wasn't a dig at the yankees, or a dig at you. You seem to be reading much more into my comment than is there.
posted by justgary at 05:54 PM on May 11, 2010
yerfatma:
Your only point is that the Yankees are great and no meanies on the other team can ever be right.
You're wrong.
The subject under discussion was the practice of brushing back or deliberately plunking a batter on the opposing team. I expressed my opinion, which I allowed -- multiple times now, for those paying attention at home -- is a minority one, that this is a boneheaded practice, because of the possibility that your clever little lesson may result in a serious injury to someone else. In response to that, wfrazerjr said:
As for a fastball in the back, do you think a professional pitcher is so unskilled as to not be able to nail a hitter pretty much wherever he wishes?
In response to that, I mentioned the Friday night incident in which Josh Beckett hit Robinson Cano. I mentioned it because it was a recent example that I happened to see as it happened (and repeated in slomo several times) that illustrated my point very well, i.e., that professional pitchers are not so skilled that they can always locate the ball exactly where they want. It illustrated my point very well because, as I made abundantly clear, Becket was obviously not throwing at Cano intentionally and hitting Cano was a mistake. The incident was mentioned as a simple counterexample to wfrazerjr's assertion about pitcher control, and none of it had a damn thing to do with Yankees and Red Sox. Still so sure my point is that "the Yankees are great and no meanies on the other team can ever be right"? Believe it if you want, but you're flat-out wrong.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 06:45 PM on May 11, 2010
That might get him another 15 minutes of fame.