11/23/24
January 17, 2006
Bonds' quest for the record could stir many emotions.: Barry Bonds was named to the World cup baseball team (or whatever its called) Why this may not sprak interest in the games, his play may be a predictor as how his chase for the "record' will go. Some wonder if Bonds is even healthy enough to go for the record. The bottom line here is that he will generate lots of emotion this season.
People's interest will definitely be sparked. All the steroids allegations are only stuff to be debated on through the media and on sites like this. When it all comes down to it, people love home runs. If Bonds makes a run, everyone will be trying to get tickets, ESPN will be showing his every at bat, and it will be all over the airwaves. His record chase, however, still may not mean he gets into Cooperstown due to his possible use of certain chemicals. My biggest question regarding this entire World Baseball Classic tournament, though, is the health of the players (including Bonds), if not during the tournament, then as the season goes on. It seems to me many pitchers don't even start throwing their hardest until near the end of spring training, and now they're going to be throwing all their stuff in this heated competition (Yes, I do think the competition will be heated once they start going at it). The toll it takes may not be noticed for a while, but for some of these guys, towards the end of the season, especially the ones that go deep into the playoffs, it may end up being too much.
posted by dyams at 06:55 PM on January 17, 2006
"The bottom line here is that he will generate lots of emotion this season." I dunno if you count yawning as an emotion, but if you do, I will certainly be doing lots of emoting regarding Big-Headed Outfielder.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 07:07 PM on January 17, 2006
Mr Big-headed outfielder has sparked thousands of emotional comments from his non-testings for steroids when asked for both blood and urine to test by Major League baseball authorities. His non-cooperative attitude is the problem. His non-response when asked for both blood and urine when confronted at numerous times is in itself the sole problem. He should be barred from participation merely BECAUSE of his frequent non-responses, but he won't, because MLB won't be part of the cause or effect.
posted by mrhockey at 07:27 PM on January 17, 2006
I for one don't care if he breaks the record or not. There is no way you can unintentionally take steroids. He knew what he was doing putting on the "cream". Hes baseballs' poster boy right now, they are gonna make so much money from "his chase". Don't get me wrong i love the long ball like everyone else but i don't care much for cheaters. Does anyone know if palmeiro is still playing or not?? i have NO respect for him, wagging his finger everywhere "NEVER, EVER" and he popped on the test. Now that fool is a freakin moron. Wasn't everyone saying that canseco's book was full of crap? i guess baseball was full of crap all along.
posted by chuy at 07:36 PM on January 17, 2006
I am sorry, I don't want to talk about the past.
posted by chuy at 07:37 PM on January 17, 2006
I might care if Bonds wasnt such a petulant, cry baby, lying jerk. Im sure I will have no choice but to pay attention, being a fan of the game. ESPN and all the other crappy sports media empires insert onslaught here. Bah Bonds.
posted by GoBirds at 08:05 PM on January 17, 2006
he will never get the respect Aaron gets nomatter if he hits 1500 hommers.
posted by j.merritt at 08:46 PM on January 17, 2006
agreed j.merritt
posted by ninjavshippo at 10:03 PM on January 17, 2006
If he MUST set a record, let it be for the number of intentional walks he gets over however long he chooses to drag this joke on. Is he good? Yeah. Is he THAT good? Uhhh.....
posted by Thumper at 11:36 PM on January 17, 2006
Even if he breaks the record, even if he never touched a roid, or even if he did them all through the 90's, Barry Bonds will be remembered as an asshole who never understood that the game is nothing without the fans. A great player for sure, a poor, inmuture and selfish excuse for a person without a doubt. I grew up watching Aarron play, that guy was a great player, and is a great person! I really don't want Bonds to even pass the Babe..........
posted by SAVANX at 11:48 PM on January 17, 2006
I am not a big fan of Bonds either. I would much rather see him retire than to break the Babe's number and Hammering Hanks. I think he whould leave well enough alone and retire. The auther stated and the comments so far would indicate, mention Bonds' name and you'll get all kinds of emotional reactions.
posted by daddisamm at 12:58 AM on January 18, 2006
.......Barry Bonds****756 hr****.........ENOUGH SAID!!!
posted by Grrrlacher at 01:31 AM on January 18, 2006
Jim Caple wrote an article on Bonds for espn.com. The article's most interesting comment comes toward the end when Caple describes baseball's home run record as "the biggest record in sports." I am going to push it a little further and say that it is the most important record in sports (at least in America) which is why the nation WILL be watching if and when Bonds approaches it. It is the most important record in American sports for two reasons: first, while there have only been two holders of the record since the home run became vogue, both of them have become among the biggest cultural icons in American history. There are few people, sports fan or not, who do not know the names of Babe Ruth or Hank Aaron. They go beyond the title of "household names" -- they have attained levels of celebrity and recognition beyond all other record-holding athletes. While you can certainly make an argument for Michael Jordan, Wayne Gretzky, and perhaps Joe Namath (my choice for football -- select your own) as rivaling Ruth and Aaron in sheer name recognition, they are not so closely identified with a particular record. I will argue that the home run record brings with it a unique American cultural standing that Bonds will certainly share, whether his record is tainted or not. Second, the home run record, more than any other, has transcended the sport that created it, and it's holder has remained emblematic of the era of the entire sports world at the time it was broken. Ruth's record changed the course of baseball dramatically, and reflected the excesses of the post-war era. His slugging not only saved baseball from the depths of the 1919 Black Sox scandal and the Mays/Chapman incident, but it essentially created a whole new game that reflected the explosiveness of the roaring '20s. Aaron's record tested America's blood pressure in the midst of a volatile civil rights movement. As a former Negro League player, he became not only the holder of baseball's most cherished record but the spokesman, by deed more than word, for the influence of segregation in sport, and by virtue of the game's cultural reflection, in American society. If and when Bonds breaks the record, his reception will certainly reflect the nation's view of chemically-enhanced performers, and Bonds' name, whether or not the truth of his guilt or innocence is ever fully uncovered, will be forever connected with baseball's darkest revelation since 1919. And, arguably, an American era defined by the precept that the ends justify the means. Regardless of how any sports fan feels about Bonds personally, they will be watching his pursuit of the record with a keen and intense eye. "Oh, people will come, Ray. People will most definitely come."
posted by BullpenPro at 04:41 AM on January 18, 2006
Bonds, hr record, "accidental" steroid use et al ...zzzzz
posted by The Casual Observer at 06:15 AM on January 18, 2006
I don't care if Bonds breaks the record, I have all the faith in the world that A-Rod will surpass him..Thank god for A-Rod!!
posted by rage311 at 08:36 AM on January 18, 2006
Jim Caple wrote an article on Bonds for espn.com. The article's most interesting comment comes toward the end when Caple describes baseball's home run record as "the biggest record in sports." I am going to push it a little further and say that it is the most important record in sports (at least in America) which is why the nation WILL be watching if and when Bonds approaches it. Some great comments Bullpen. However, did you even read the link; same article as the link. Your type of comments was the main reason why I put the Link here in the first place. I am just a little confused.
posted by daddisamm at 09:38 AM on January 18, 2006
1st - He has never been convicted of steroid use. The only information any of you have that he has done steroids is "LEAKED" grand jury testimony (which is illegal) that he, nor anyone else involved, can every legally comment about. Now I'm not naive and he most definitely HAS done steroids, but the point is, there is no proof. So all of you hoping for an asterisk or him not getting into the hall, you're mislead 2nd - He put together a hall of fame career BEFORE he ever bulked up from "allegedly" steroids. He'd get voted in for that reason alone. 3rd - All the Bonds haters were coming out of the woodwork last year saying he faked his injury so as to not have to submit to testing and said we wouldn't see him again. Guess what, he came back, was the same size as always, and never failed a drug test. I never heard any of the bonds "conspiracy theorist" come back and explain that. 4th - There are a LOT worse people in sports. Bonds is an ass. But why do people hate him so much for being an ass? You have guys that abuse their wives, beat old men with golf clubs, attempt to run over trick-or-treaters in a car, machete their employees, etc....yet Bonds is the one that everyone hates so much. Why? Because he doesn't give interviews? Yea, that makes sense. You guys are a bunch of sheep. The media gets pissed that he's not talking to them so villify him. People then fall in line and hate him and act like it's their own choice that they hate him so much. Yet guys like Cal Ripken, by all counts, was one of the biggest asses in sports. The man didn't even stay in the same hotel as his other teammates during his latter years. Yet let's erect a statue for him because the media says we should like him!
posted by bdaddy at 09:49 AM on January 18, 2006
What a joke MLB will be if Bonds gets the HR title! Or if they let him take it. It that's the case, then they should freely distribute steroids to all the players. You know...to keep it fair. If anyone remembers the start of his career he was more of an average hitter than a hr hitter(by the way just like Peyton Manning....can't win the big one). Then like magic he's some huge bohemouth cranking 1 hr out of every 4 at bats. What a bunch of crap! By the way...I don't think Hank Arron or the Babe ever took steroids to get their titles. It's not a matter of him being an ass either. I look at it as an unfair advantage to the younger players who want to compete with these veterans who are pretty much allowed to pump themselves up on steroids. My opinion is that all of these jackasses that were warned and repromanded actually pay the price that Pete Rose had to pay and take them right out of the record books. Never mind the asteric. They don't even deserve that! And yes, Bonds is a poor excuse of a man, but that's ok because when his little peepee shrivles up into a raisin he can open up the record book and be proud that he broke the record by cheating!
posted by thdaplumber1 at 10:02 AM on January 18, 2006
Yeah Bonds might be a jerk and his numbers are suspect, but this is what the MLB gets for not recognizing the steroid problem soon enough and putting in strict enough restrictions. Heck, if you have a problem with the record (if he gets it) you can buy your own copy of the record book and draw in an asterik.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 10:13 AM on January 18, 2006
....yet Bonds is the one that everyone hates so much. Why? You have caused me to reconsider my hate for Bonds. (Thinking...) Okay, I still hate him.
posted by STLCardinalfan at 10:53 AM on January 18, 2006
bdaddy: Your 4th point is dead on. Most of the media hatred can be traced to Rick Reilly and Sports Illustrated. Bonds snubbed Reilly (and SI) a long time ago, and he's been on a smear campaign since then. He's even been caught taking quotes from other people out of context in order to paint an evil picture of Bonds (the "Back off or I'll snap!" quote immediately comes to mind). If anyone remembers the start of his career he was more of an average hitter than a hr hitter. Let's look at the history books and find out for ourselves! # of times in top 10 for AVG (NL) in first 10 seasons: 2 (1992, 1993). # of times in top 10 for HR (NL) in first 10 seasons: 6 (1988, 1990, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995) It looks like he was more of a HR hitter than an AVG hitter (compared to the rest of the league).
posted by grum@work at 10:58 AM on January 18, 2006
I get the feeling that this Bonds guy isn't the most beloved figure in sports. Ironically, though, Henry Aaron drew far more hate when he broke Ruth's record than Bonds will ever draw. There were millions of people who were outraged by Aaron, a black man, passing Ruth in the record books and they called for mlb to prevent him from doing so. And, of course, they were hundreds of assasination threats. (Please don't mistake what I'm saying; there are plenty of good reasons to dislike Bonds. Yes, the media may overdo it because he's uncooperative, but he's obviously a person who many reasonably find extremely unpleasant and unlikable. ) Every time a big home run record has been broken - with the notable exception of 1998 (at least at the time) - there has been a ton of controversy with many folks claiming that the new record should not be put into the record books because of the special circumstances. The special circumstances are different over time - ballpark changes, rule changes, equipment changes, expansion, and now steroids - but somehow there's almost always something that causes controversy. The reality is that mlb has had a problem with players taking performance enhancing drugs since 1945. We have no idea who took what and how much over the last sixty years. It's obvious that drug use has been extremely widespread, involving both pitchers and hitters, skinny players and muscled players, etc. Virtually every single major league stat over the past 60 years has been affected by drug use, and we simply have no way of even beginning to sort out everything. We can't change the record books; we just have to be able to read them intelligently, and take context into account.
posted by spira at 11:14 AM on January 18, 2006
3rd - All the Bonds haters were coming out of the woodwork last year saying he faked his injury so as to not have to submit to testing and said we wouldn't see him again. Guess what, he came back, was the same size as always, and never failed a drug test. I never heard any of the bonds "conspiracy theorist" come back and explain that. He spent all of that time in a gym, far away from prying eyes, purging his system of the steroids and getting back as much of the bulk as naturally as he could. The guy has already said that he used the cream and the clear- the same steroids that got a lot of other pro athletes early retirement. He refuses to cooperate with tests and the MLB allows it. If fans felt that Maris had an asterisk on his record because the season was longer than in Ruth's day, how many asterisks will Bonds get?
posted by irunfromclones at 12:38 PM on January 18, 2006
He refuses to cooperate with tests and the MLB allows it. Bullshit. "However, Bonds has never failed a drug test, despite being tested by MLB in 2003, 2004 and 2005."
posted by grum@work at 03:32 PM on January 18, 2006
This thread appears every few months. The Bonds haters come out and blah blah blah. He's hated partially because he is an ass & partially because it's popular to hate him. The media are in a win-win situation w/ Bonds - if he snubs them, he's an arrogant ass and if he talks to them, he's an arrogant ass. Regardless if Bonds is on TV or in the papers/mags it means that lots & lots of eyeballs will be attracted and advertisers pay more for lots of eyeballs. They like that. He'll pass Ruth this season and we'll all be watching. And someday it'll be discovered that upwards of 75% of MLB players are using or have used performance enhancing drugs at some point in their career. The masses will be shocked and express their disgust and then they'll cheat on their taxes and/or spouses. You'll see :)
posted by JohnSFO at 03:52 PM on January 18, 2006
He's hated partially because he is an ass & partially because it's popular to hate him. And partially because it's a regurgitated, recycled discussion. Cat food is disgusting right out of the can, and is not improved by being vomited up two or three times (always on a different spot of the rug). He'll pass Ruth this season and we'll all be watching. Hell, no, we won't. I'm much more likely to be attending a game of the North Adams Steeplecats, where the hot dogs are a buck fifty, the fans know baseball, the kids participate in the Frozen T-shirt Contest between the fourth and fifth inning, and "Take Me Out to the Ballgame" is the song during the seventh inning stretch.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 04:07 PM on January 18, 2006
I'm with l_b_b, but I'll be at a different park.
posted by mr_crash_davis at 05:27 PM on January 18, 2006
4th - There are a LOT worse people in sports... Don' t I get to hate Bonds and those other players, too? Why do I have to pick just one? Actually, I don't hate Bonds. The only time I have seen him live, at Yankee Stadium, he hit a home run against Andy Pettitte that literally brought me out of my seat. It was the most spectacular home run I have ever seen. In an era in which he is hardly the only one to have been juiced, he is still lapping the field. No other hitter allows the pitcher a smaller margin of error or turns a pitch around faster. Enhanced or not, he is a special hitter. I am just a little confused. You should be confused, daddisam. I am an idiot. I couldn't get your link to open for some reason, and I went ahead and assumed it was one of the several articles I had already read announcing the WBC rosters. I owe you a ballpark frank.
posted by BullpenPro at 07:01 PM on January 18, 2006
Yeah I am a Bonds hater. Used to be a Jeff Kent hater too. Put him in Dodger Blue and all is forgiven. All you haters out there would be singing a different tune if he was inserted in your favorite lineup, and I don't mean a fantasy lineup.
posted by Sailor at 11:53 PM on January 18, 2006
Well that just begs for a Most Dislikable lineup. For me, personally, it probably looks like this: C Ramon Castro 1B Justin Morneau 2B Kent 3B Chipper Jones SS Miguel Tejada (with a bullet) OF J.D. Drew OF Kenny Lofton OF Ricky Ledee DH Carl Everett P Sidney Ponson Some tough calls there -- it's funny how few really despicable characters there are in baseball, I think.
posted by BullpenPro at 09:09 AM on January 19, 2006
All you haters out there would be singing a different tune if he was inserted in your favorite lineup, and I don't mean a fantasy lineup. Put him in your lineup. I'll keep Pujols and company.
posted by STLCardinalfan at 09:13 AM on January 19, 2006
why is Justin Morneau on your list? He hasnt been around long enough to gain a bad rep. I am still confused :-)
posted by daddisamm at 10:00 AM on January 19, 2006
Why is J.D. Drew in your lineup? He is never on the field long enough to be an ass.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 11:13 AM on January 19, 2006
He pissed everyone off long before he ever hit an MLB field.
posted by yerfatma at 11:45 AM on January 19, 2006
I agree with JD Drew. I believe the twins drafted him first and he refused to sign. SD. Didnt he like play in the Northern league with the St Paul Saints? FYI did you know that the Saints along with several other Northern League team have left the League and Formed a new League call the Amercian Assocaition. I still am a little confused about Morneau!
posted by daddisamm at 11:58 AM on January 19, 2006
Can we put Ron Artest and T.O. in as honorable mentions?
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 01:22 PM on January 19, 2006
Can we put Ron Artest and T.O. in as honorable mentions? This whole exercise wasn't silly enough for you already?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 01:30 PM on January 19, 2006
Why do we have to even mention Artest and T.O.?
posted by daddisamm at 02:44 PM on January 19, 2006
Did I miss something about Artest and T.O.?
posted by irunfromclones at 03:19 PM on January 19, 2006
grum@work- proof that the only tests Bonds had were administered privately, not by the MLB: Bonds testified that he met Conte a few times but never paid for the supplements, instead doing an ad endorsing ZMA for Muscle & Fitness magazine. Bonds said he couldn't explain an invoice stating $450 for blood tests; when asked about documents stating he had paid $450 for a bottle of Depo-Testosterone, Bonds said, "I have never seen this bottle or any bottle pertaining that says Depo-Testosterone." Just the bottle you paid cash for that didn't have a label. According to the Chronicle, prosecutors questioned Bonds about several other documents, including some that suggested he was using the steroid trenbolone and modafinil, an anti-narcolepsy drug used as a stimulant. Bonds said he had never heard of those drugs. Another document read, "Barry 12-2-02, T, 1 CC G -- pee." "T could mean anything," Bonds said. "G could mean anything. And pee could probably mean anything." Sure, and you also believe in the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny. Bonds also testified he didn't know about documents indicating BALCO had begun screening his blood for both nutritional deficiencies and steroids in 2001. Bonds did say, however, that in 2003 he became suspicious of baseball's steroid testing program and asked Anderson to have him tested. Bonds knew that MLB had updated the tests and was running scared. His suspicions were that he would get tested and busted. "We got tested two times this season unannounced," Bonds tesified. "I don't trust baseball. They say it's anonymous, but then they put your name on it. So I don't trust baseball. So I asked Greg ... 'I want to know what baseball's doing behind our backs.' "I never saw the papers, never saw the results. Greg just said, 'You're negative,'" Bonds said. The "we" in that statement meaning the Giants as a team, not Bonds himself. He fucking got scared and had his pal run tests similar to the MLB's looking for the "undetectable" steroids "According to the Chronicle, Bonds said he never paid Anderson for drugs but said he paid him $15,000 in 2003 for weight training and a $20,000 bonus after his 73-home run season. "I paid him in cash," Bonds said. "I make $17 million." As anal as Bonds is about everything in his life, does anyone really think that he would pay cash for weight training and a bonus, both clearly red flags for a person of his income level with the IRS? Now that is bullshit.
posted by irunfromclones at 03:39 PM on January 19, 2006
There's a fine line between wisdom and analocity. That is a very insightful commentary, irun -- I'd like to know what source you are referencing. To daddisam, I had a tough time at first base (I cut Giambi a lot of slack for owning up to what he did full on, at least to the courts). Morneau didn't impress me when he fought with Torii Hunter, one of my favorite players, last season. Rookies should shut up and listen. I do have a few honorable mentions (not including Artest and T.O.) that don't exactly fit at first -- can I put Soriano there?
posted by BullpenPro at 04:15 AM on January 20, 2006
oops forgive me for the typo-Sprak should be spark.< /em>em>