12/21/24
January 10, 2016
Steelers Coach Should've Been Flagged for Being on Field: The officials should have thrown a 15-yard penalty on Pittsburgh Steelers outside linebackers coach Joey Porter for being on the field at the end of last night's wild card game with the Cincinnati Bengals. Only trainers are allowed on the field to treat an injury. Coaches have to seek permission. Porter verbally engaged Bengals players and Adam Jones was flagged for confronting him, setting up a 35-yard field goal by the Steelers with 18 seconds left.
Here's a gif of Porter in amidst the Bengals players. Does Cincy's Gilberry drag him into the group of Bengals players or was he already on his way into the group when Gilberry grabs onto him?
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posted by NoMich at 10:43 AM on January 10, 2016
Joey Porter went on to the field to enquire if Cincinnati would help Pittsburgh to win the game. The answer was "yes."
posted by Mr Bismarck at 11:07 AM on January 10, 2016
I don't think any flags needed to be thrown there.
posted by tron7 at 01:05 PM on January 10, 2016
I question whether Jones did enough to justify a flag, given the moment and all the chippy behavior throughout the game that went unflagged. But given Porter's presence, it seemed like a situation tailor made for offsetting penalties.
posted by rcade at 01:09 PM on January 10, 2016
It does look like Gilberry bumps him into the group, then #55 grabs Porter's jacket. Still, Porter shouldn't have been there.
The reason Porter didn't draw a penalty (other than incompetence) was that he kept his cool perfectly. He didn't make any sudden movements, he didn't try to act tough, he simply started backing up with a "come on, man" look on his face.
Pacman got a penalty because he looked like he was trying to re-heat a situation that looked like it was cooling down on its own (as Porter backed away).
posted by grum@work at 01:28 PM on January 10, 2016
But given Porter's presence, it seemed like a situation tailor made for offsetting penalties.
At most. Porter is the outside linebackers coach. What was he doing on the field checking on an injured wide receiver, rather than the wide receiver coach? He was plainly trying to incite the Bengals players, which he had done as a player for a decade. He stood at midfield before every fucking game those two teams played throughout his career jawing at the Bengals. Now he does it as a coach in a playoff game and is expressly rewarded for the behavior by receiving the winning field goal on a platter?
posted by tahoemoj at 02:35 PM on January 10, 2016
Regardless of his team role, when have NFL refs ever thrown a flag at any players/personnel on the field during an injury timeout, especially one where the player was knocked unconscious? The 15yd for the dirty hit was unquestionable, but as grum points out, Porter didn't actually do anything or make contact- unlike 95 who bumped him into a group of Bengals, or Pacman's I-don't-know-what attempt that resulted in him hitting a ref. That second and game-defining penalty came when the hotheaded Bengals initiated further contact in the form of Jones taking a swing at Porter and hitting a ref, which was the only other egregious contact after play stopped.
posted by hincandenza at 06:28 PM on January 10, 2016
I wouldn't say Porter did nothing. After Brown was being led off the field he stayed behind and jawed at Adam Jones and other Bengals players in their defensive huddle ("multiple Bengals players said Porter lashed out at them verbally while on the field," per Sporting News). What's an opposing coach doing anywhere near the other team's huddle verbally confronting them long into an injury timeout? It's ridiculous he got away with that.
Jones' take: ""He ain't supposed to be on the (expletive) field! He was talking all kinds of (expletive), yelling at (Burfict), saying, 'You a dirty son of a bitch ... Take your bitch ass out of here ' So I turned to him and said, 'Why are you talking?' I didn't even touch him. And they threw a flag."
It seems like Jones struck the ref unintentionally when confronting Porter. Refs get hit sometimes by accident when players are pushing each other around and usually don't throw a flag.
posted by rcade at 07:36 PM on January 10, 2016
I started out hoping the Bengals would win but by the end of the game I was happy they lost. Their team has a bunch of gangsters with no discipline. Their fans are no better. It was disgusting that they cheered when Big Ben was hurt.
Thank god I don't have to live in that hell hole.
I am definitely not a Steelers fan but the Bengals gave a black eye to the NFL yesterday.
posted by JohnSoCal at 08:48 PM on January 10, 2016
You paint with a pretty broad brush there, Johnny. Burfict's hit was dirty as hell. Why are the Bengals all "gangsters"? And 'their fans are no better' is horseshit. You mean to tell me that Cincy fans are the only fans in the league who would have cheered a big hit on an archrival quarterback that completely changed the momentum of the game?. Bullshit.
You ever been to Cincinnati? It's a hell hole why?Final call of bullshit. Where in SoCal are you? Plenty of hell holes there that make Cincinnati look like a paradise.
posted by tahoemoj at 12:00 AM on January 11, 2016
Bengals have 2 problems to resolve going forward.
Bad problem:
Their key players have proven once again they cannot handle the pressure of big games and self destruct. They can't count on Burfict and Jones in big moments.
Would suck to be Marvin Lewis .. do you leave these guys on the field knowing you are flirting with disaster or do you have to sit them when you need them most?
Good problem:
Well, partially.
AJ McCarron was rock solid and continued to look like he is becoming a franchise QB.
Except they just gave Andy Dalton a huge contract and have committed to him until 2020.
By mid next season Cincy will be paying $15M avg per season to their backup QB for the next 4 seasons.
posted by cixelsyd at 10:00 AM on January 11, 2016
Their key players have proven once again they cannot handle the pressure of big games and self destruct
Especially Andy Dalton.
posted by yerfatma at 11:27 AM on January 11, 2016
Especially Andy Dalton.
Win or lose, Bengals fans really wanted Dalton to have the chance to get that monkey off his back this year. I know that I was extremely excited (for about 5 minutes) for him to go into New England and show that the playoffs were no longer his Waterloo.
They can't count on Burfict and Jones in big moments.
Jones is a solid corner, but there are plenty out there who can do what he does. Burfict, on the other hand, is a tough call. Before he self-immolated on the final play, he showed that he could be a transcendent player, a linebacker who can take over the game singlehandedly and carry his team to a (near) victory. He was all over the field, sacking the quarterback, intercepting passes, and generally disrupting anything Pittsburgh tried to do. He was pissed off and his aggression was properly channeled against his opponent. But then the aggression got to be too much for him and he unraveled everything he had done right by taking a cheap shot that was both dirty and unnecessary under the circumstances. (Say what you will about Shazier's cheap helmet hit on Bernard-at least he was making a tackle on a ball carrier, and not just trying to injure.) So if you're Marvin, what do you do? The Bengals would not have been in a position to win that game without Burfict, but then he ultimately cost them the game.
By mid next season Cincy will be paying $15M avg per season to their backup QB for the next 4 seasons.
Slow that roll a bit. McCarron played well in the 4th quarter, but let's not forget how ineffective he was for the first three. He is certainly turning into a backup that Bengals fans are happy to have around, but he's no [regular season] Andy Dalton.
posted by tahoemoj at 11:41 AM on January 11, 2016
Bengals defensive coordinator Paul Guenther said he spoke to Joey Porter "before the game and asked him not to engage with any Bengals players after Porter got into it with them multiple times during the ugly regular season game between the two teams." He now calls Porter an "embarrassment to the coaching profession."
posted by rcade at 05:12 PM on January 11, 2016
McCarron played well in the 4th quarter, but let's not forget how ineffective he was for the first three
But he was good in the 4th. Good enough to win.
Bengals haven't seen that in 4 Dalton playoff appearances.
posted by cixelsyd at 05:20 PM on January 11, 2016
He now calls Porter an "embarrassment to the coaching profession."
I have no problem with that assessment.
posted by grum@work at 05:27 PM on January 11, 2016
Any reason they wouldn't trade McCarron to another team? If his stock is overinflated, it seems like a good thing to do, maybe pick up athe least a 3rd round draft pick, possibly 2nd if a team is desperate enough.
posted by LionIndex at 05:48 PM on January 11, 2016
Denver bar owners institute citywide ban on sale of Kevlar underwear in advance of the arrival of Steelers coaching staff for Sunday's game.
posted by beaverboard at 06:13 PM on January 11, 2016
Burfict suspended three games, discipline of other players and coaches pending.
posted by Etrigan at 10:27 PM on January 11, 2016
I'm not saying Porter is a saint, nor that he shouldn't be fined, nor even that the refs didn't let this one get out of control long before this play. But a penalty flag would be undeserved, and is just irrational sour grapes. Also, it'd be nice to have someone other than Bengals players or coaches telling us what he allegedly did or said. There is also this reddit comment, and subsequent replies, that seem to paint out what happened on the field.
Putting it bluntly, there is something ethically bankrupt about trying to equate teammates/personnel improperly being on the field while an injured player is being tended to- a technical rule violation that is never really enforced even though maybe it should be- and attempting to hit/strike an opponent like Jones did, regardless of what was said. Is there a rule in the NFL that allows for alleged trash-talking to be met directly with violence? I wasn't aware of that rule. Burfict really missed the boat in that case; he should have told a ref that Brown was a-lookin' at him all funny-like, then the ref would have no choice but to rescind the penalty flag on the personal foul. Real men gotta stand up and demand respect, by whatever means necessary.
Le sigh. In any case, this image also showed up on reddit; by my count of the green circles, that's like 1, 2, 3... 9 penalties on the Bengals right there. Nine! Boy howdy, it's a good thing the NFL officials routinely call out players and personnel on the field during an injury timeout, which as we all remember is why the Bengals were then assessed 135 yards in penalties.
posted by hincandenza at 12:05 AM on January 12, 2016
Also, it'd be nice to have someone other than Bengals players or coaches telling us what he allegedly did or said.
When you linger among the other team instead of going back to your sideline, the only people around you are their players and coaches. In the video, as Brown is being led off Porter turns to say something to Burfict. I'd suggest that Porter's entire playing career should tell you it was trash talking.
As for Jones trying to punch Porter, I don't see it with your certainty. I see some kind of gesture that could have been an attempt to point at him, shove him or punch him. If he didn't strike a ref by accident, I bet that doesn't get a flag.
Do players and coaches normally get flagged for being on the field when they shouldn't be? No. But when they get themselves into an altercation with the other team on the other team's side of the field, they should be. If Porter's conduct was egregious enough to fine him, it was enough to flag him.
Ultimately, what bothers me is that a playoff game was decided in significant part by an assistant coach being somewhere he shouldn't be and saying something that antagonized opposing players. That's an embarrassment to the game, stacked on the embarrassment of the Burfict dirty hit and the lack of control both teams displayed throughout the game. I hope next weekend's quality of play makes up for this one.
posted by rcade at 12:36 AM on January 12, 2016
a penalty flag would be undeserved, and is just irrational sour grapes... 9 penalties on the Bengals right there. Nine!
Seems like you're completely missing the point of the argument being made. If Porter walks out to 'his' player (Brown isn't a linebacker, outside or otherwise, if I recall) to check on his well-being, assist him off the field, etc., nobody makes the argument that his actions warrant a flag. But he did not do that; instead, he purposefully engaged Bengals players while on the field.
And let's assume that we have no knowledge of Porter's antics throughout his career, and assume that he was saying to Burfict and/or Jones or anyone else, "boy, this has sure been a dandy of a game, hasn't it?" That is still engaging the other players. At the end of a heated game full of bad blood, anyone who has ever played or watched a sporting event might see that there is potential for - dare I say even the likelihood of - a reaction from the people spoken to.
Now, turning to your Zapruder-like discovery of the Bengals coaches on that grassy knoll...if you look at the 1,2,3,4...9 (gasp! what a find!) Bengals coaches mulling about near the sidelines, what are NONE of them doing? Hint--none are in the Steelers huddle, and none are engaging with Steelers players. It's almost completely different, huh?
Finally, nobody in their right mind is disputing that Burfict's hit was stupid and the call was warranted. The argument is that this was a fucking NFL playoff game, and it was decided when the officials, with the potential to call multiple personal fouls on both teams, arbitrarily decided to call a lone personal foul on one player reacting to an unsportsmanlike action by an opposing coach.
Is there a rule in the NFL that allows for alleged trash-talking to be met directly with violence? I wasn't aware of that rule.
And we circle back to the fact that there IS a rule in the NFL that allows trash talking by coaches on the field to be met with a personal foul flag. I assume you've read the post and are, by now, aware of it.
posted by tahoemoj at 10:08 AM on January 12, 2016
Putting it bluntly, there is something ethically bankrupt about trying to equate teammates/personnel improperly being on the field while an injured player is being tended to- a technical rule violation that is never really enforced even though maybe it should be- and attempting to hit/strike an opponent like Jones did, regardless of what was said. Is there a rule in the NFL that allows for alleged trash-talking to be met directly with violence?
Coaches on the field rule should be enforced when it's causing a problem. Porter on the field inciting opposing players is a problem. Nine Bengals on the field near their sideline is not really a problem.
I also don't see an attempt to hit/strike by Jones. He was probably going to push him and get really angry but he didn't even get that far.
posted by tron7 at 10:38 AM on January 12, 2016
Porter hopes that the league won't fine him as much as they fined Tomlin for trying to trip a Ravens player.
Can't believe that Ndamukong went to Miami when this division is where he rightfully belongs.
posted by beaverboard at 11:27 AM on January 12, 2016
Porter's reportedly going to be fined. He and fellow Steelers assistant Mike Munchak should get more punishment than that and face a suspension. When the refs are so concerned about a game becoming out of control that they issue pre-game warnings and stand at midfield before kickoff, coaches who lose it during the game should be severely punished.
The refs let this one get out of hand. It's a black eye for the NFL to have a game end like that and feature so much unsportsmanlike behavior. Cincinnati fans even chipped in by throwing objects at Ben Roethlisberger as he was being carted off following his injury.