12/18/24
August 23, 2005
Hossa for Heatley: Mr. Pay Me (+Dman) swapped for Dany Lead Foot. I never woulda thunk it.
OK, so now where is Martin St Louis gonna go? I can't imagine that playing alongside Lecavalier's inflated contract will sit well with him given that the Lightning are tight for cap space so probably can't pay him what he would seem to be worth. St Louis only won the Hart trophy, Pearson and the Art Ross last year while Vinnie... somehow gets a huge contract that nobody seems to think he quite deserved.
posted by gspm at 03:55 PM on August 23, 2005
2 birds, 1 stone. Heatley's image and capital earning potential took a permanent hit when he crashed his Ferrari in Georgia. Hossa was percieved to be over-valued and asking for too much loot. I'd say both franchise's make-out on the perception front.
posted by garfield at 03:56 PM on August 23, 2005
Damn. And I was hoping to see Heatley/Kovalchuk combine for at least a few years. And Heatley was the face of the Thrashers. But, with what happened here in Atlanta, he probably really did want to get away the whole accident situation. ANd I have to agree with Weedy- I'm glad we got someone who can at least help us now.
posted by jmd82 at 05:36 PM on August 23, 2005
Sorry Weedy, JMD, while Heatley will make things exciting, the Dominator will break your hearts just like Lalame did. On the bright side, at least you don't have Bobby Clark. Sitting here in Detroit, waiting, & waiting for something to happen, (at least we didn't get Lindross!)
posted by RedStrike at 06:22 PM on August 23, 2005
Weedy is a Leafs fan. I am sure he will be happy if Hasek breaks the same hearts that Lalime did.
posted by gspm at 07:20 PM on August 23, 2005
I too was shocked by Lecavalier's contract - struck me as tremendous overpayment. TB still has the cap room to give St. Louis a similar deal and there doesn't seem to be any way around it now. But Lecavalier was a $4-$5 million player tops, and now he has Iginal/Naslund/Pronger money. RedStrike - I can't see too much wrong with Bobby Clark these days. Besides the assholism, I mean. Philly is a powerhouse thanks to Clark taking over the free agent market and making very good drafts in the last four years.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 07:59 AM on August 24, 2005
My apologies to Mr. McSmokey re the Ottawa blunder. But adding such pylons as Hatcher, Therien, & Rathje in the new run & gun age of the NHL confirms to me that Bobby is still playing in the 70s, (maybe one too many concussions). And that is just the most recent of a looong list of Philly Phollies with Clark as the ringmaster!
posted by RedStrike at 08:25 AM on August 24, 2005
...and still no tender. the Boobster still reigns, though i'm more scared leading up to this campaign than in previous years. The Flyers will maim any team they meet in a seven game series.
posted by garfield at 08:39 AM on August 24, 2005
I can't beleive Muckler had the balls to pull the trigger on such a big trade.Perhaps,Ottawa will get a winger who will show up in the playoffs??.If they stay w/ the Dominator in net, they may never get the chance to find out if Heatley for Hossa/De Vries worked out....
posted by thefurbs at 08:42 AM on August 24, 2005
Hossa was (and is) a good player, no doubt. But he's not a standout, not as Heatley has been (unless you call nearly blinding another player with a stick a stand-out thing). He definitely doesn't deserve the kind of money that he's been asking for. That said, Heatley IS a question mark. He hasn't really been in top form lately, what with injuries and the accident and all that, and it is uncertain whether he can get back. From the looks of it, Heatley might not even qualify for the Olympic team this year.
posted by mkn at 12:13 PM on August 24, 2005
I don't understand where the Hossa doubting is coming from. Last season (that was played) Hossa was a grade A wing. Point a game in the regular season. 3 goals, 1 assist, 4.5 shots a game (and good ones if my memory doesn't betray me) for the 7-game series against the Leafs. The year before, same fine poultry. Point a game for the regular season. 16 pts in 18 games in the post season. And again he generated many chances himself. The guy is really good. And according to this Sens fan contributed many intangibles to the team as well.
posted by garfield at 12:24 PM on August 24, 2005
...And according to this Sens fan... to clarify, i'm a bud fan: bud, budweiser, the maple leafs...
posted by garfield at 01:06 PM on August 24, 2005
But adding such pylons as Hatcher, Therien, & Rathje in the new run & gun age of the NHL confirms to me that Bobby is still playing in the 70s, (maybe one too many concussions). And that is just the most recent of a looong list of Philly Phollies with Clark as the ringmaster! While i would agree with you in the past clark has made many mistakes. However he has made up for that in the past few years.He added hatcher/rathje because he already has 2(johnsson/pitkanen)puck carrying/power play d-men.3 counting kapanen.that said he needed to add size and muscle and he did.And clark scouting and drafting players like mike richards and jeff carter(roy canidate), proves he has "recently" done his job well. As for the "new run and gun age" of the NHL. They say that every year.Yes there have been changes(that i really like actually)but every year each team has that "shaq" player parked in front of the goalie.which seems to be the mainstay in the powerplay/half court game.And who better to "lean on" that guy than derian hatcher or mike rathje. the forsberg signing speaks for itself. Clarks' grade this year as gm "A" Clarks' grade the year he sent forsberg/steve dueschane/ron hextal/mike ricci/chris simon/mark recchi and 15 million in cash to hartford(it was hartford right?) for lindros "F" Thats one hell of a turn around if i do say so myself.
posted by Web_Spiner at 01:32 AM on August 25, 2005
Didnt want to leave without touching the actual topic of the thread. I dont like the trade.I like Hossa's potential.He will sooner or later stop disappearing in the playoffs.the sens were always a scary team to play when hossa was hot.Heatley is deffinitely good.not sure i would have given up the picks along with a player with so much skating potential.I mean with the "new run and gun" NHL coming along,hossa should blossom. Not sure either team will be a factor in the playoffs. 1 more bad move clark made a few years ago. He gave up that young goalie prospect Maxime oulett and a 2nd rnd pick for adam oates at the trade dead line.He was a free agent at the end of that year.He signed with the ducks and won the cup after half a season with philly. Bad move. Clarks biggest downside "we dont need a big name goalie, the team we put in front of our goalie should be good enough to win it". thats just idiotic. Spend some money on a goalie dumbass.
posted by Web_Spiner at 02:06 AM on August 25, 2005
Some factual errors: * The trade was with the Nordiques, and Mark Recchi was not part of it. * Adam Oates and the Mighty Ducks have never won the Cup. Oates made it to the finals twice: with Washington in '98 and Anaheim in '03.
posted by qbert72 at 07:18 AM on August 25, 2005
Okay, I don't wanna harp. but the error keeps creeping down the page, it is Clarke. The big trade your give Clarke an F for was (famously) to the Quebec Nordiques since Eric Lindros refused to play there. That team then moved to Colorado and won the cup. Adam Oates played for the Ducks and made the final but the Ducks didn't win. Lost game 7 to the Devils. As for spending money on a goalie - Esche certainly proved to be a good value when they beat the Leafs who must have 4 times as much salary tied up in their starting goalie. They made it to a game freakin' 7 of the semifinals. The only active goalies to win cups have been Osgoode, Belfour and Khabibulin (as far as I can recall). I wouldn't but too unhappy with a cheap Esche in net but then again I am not a Flyers fan. on preview - d'oh.
posted by gspm at 07:23 AM on August 25, 2005
The only active goalies to win cups have been Osgoode, Belfour and Khabibulin (as far as I can recall) Did Marty Brodeur retire? =D One other thing...was Bobby Clarke even the GM of Philly at the time of "The Trade"?
posted by MeatSaber at 07:44 AM on August 25, 2005
thank you both for the corrections.. 1.i knew it was clarkE but for some reason after i previewed the other posts and saw no E on the end of his name,i figured i was the one making the error. So i deleted the e from his name everywhere i typed it. 2.Further more i wasnt sure if Oates won the cup or not,but i knew there was a game 7(just couldnt for the life of me remember if he was on the winning team)and you're right. it wasnt recchi it was huffman and a first round pick in 1993 entry draft: He was originally drafted by the Flyers in the first round (sixth overall) of the 1991 NHL Entry Draft. His rights were traded by the Flyers, along with Steve Duchesne, Kerry Huffman, Mike Ricci, Ron Hextall, a first round pick in the 1993 NHL Entry Draft, $15,000,000 and future considerations Since he gave away half the team i just assumed recchi was included. I must say being a flyers fan and knowing his nickname is "Clarky". I should have known i was right with the spelling. All that said, nothing makes up for the worst trade in pro sports history whether it was hartford or quebec. they became the powerhouse known as the colorado av's. But with the way Clarke is operating now. he is most certainly making up for it. Forsberg alone turned out to be twice as good as lindros. I can only imagine who the first rounder was in 1993(was it sakic)???if not you can bet it was somebody good. Look how the av's turned out upto 10 yrs after that trade. Quebec sucked before that. until this day they thank Bob Clarke. Answered my own question: 1993 entry draft first round to Que from Philly SELECTION # 10 THIBAULT, Jocelyn G PHI-QUE Sherbrooke Thats just ridiculous wasnt there another team involved in the trade?i think there was. was it the islanders? if so. look what happened the same year 1993 entry draft:first round SELECTION #14 DEADMARSH, Adam C NYI-QUE Portland SELECTION #23 BERTUZZI, Todd C QUE-NYI Guelph
posted by Web_Spiner at 08:11 AM on August 25, 2005
SELECTION # 10 THIBAULT, Jocelyn G PHI-QUE Sherbrooke Who was traded to Montreal in 1996 for... (drum roll) Patrick Roy...
posted by MeatSaber at 08:22 AM on August 25, 2005
Qbert72, i just read the entire article about the 'trade".Nice. it proved my point.worst trade in history(in my opinion). And qspm, i like esche,however i just wish at some point that the flyers would put a big name back there. The same way i wish the sixers would get a big name center. I mean how long can philly fans live with chamberlin(at center)and bernie parent(in goal). Meatsaber, he was named senior VP in charge of player/personnel june 1992. Made the lindros deal. was named VP/GM of florida panthers march one 1993(after flyers owner was qouted as saying "what in the sam hell did you just do") And i still like Hossa over heatly.
posted by Web_Spiner at 08:46 AM on August 25, 2005
RE: Factual Errors - Facts are simple and facts are straight Facts are lazy and facts are late Facts all come with points of view Facts don’t do what I want them to Facts just twist the truth around Facts are living turned inside out Facts are getting the best of them Facts are nothing on the face of things Facts don’t stain the furniture Facts go out and slam the door Facts are written all over your face Facts continue to change their shape /David Byrne
posted by Samsonov14 at 05:55 PM on August 25, 2005
Sorry, I didn't mean to bring all the spacebars with me on vacation.
posted by DrJohnEvans at 06:48 PM on August 28, 2005
I do not think Heatley is better than Hossa. And you can't tell me Hossa was a playoff disappearer this past season -- he was one of the few guys who wasn't. That said, I like this trade, because it will allow Ottawa to keep Chara and Redden next year. That's the only reason I like it. Heatley is an exciting player to have but in my opinion he is not as talented as Hossa, nor will he be as productive. He may be more marketable. We will have to see. But this was a salary cap deal without question.
posted by Succa at 09:05 AM on August 30, 2005
Damn - trade demand. What a coup for Ottawa. Huge, good move. Heatley is wayyyyy better than Hossa - who routinely disappears in the playoffs - or in games when you hit him. Wow. Ottawa just got a first line guy to score - let's see if he has the sack to stand up and lead that team of chronic underachievers. Actually given that Heatley seemed to demand a deal, a pretty good swap for Atlanta too. At least they didn't take 2 draft picks and prospect. I was never a big Hossa fan though.