04/25/24
April 21, 2004
Unless there is some divine intervention, God will see to the release of Kurt Warner from the St. Louis Rams on June 1. It isn't in His plan for the quarterback to be signed by former Coach Dick Vermeil to back up Trent Green, but, Lord willing, Warner might end up in Chicago or Oakland. "I'm not looking at what's best for me," says Kurt. "I'm looking at what's best for the Lord and spreading his message." Wouldn't that be the Saints?
Amen.
posted by rcade at 04:02 PM on April 21, 2004
Wow! The wording of the posting is changing before my very eyes. Rcade, are you editing behind the scenes? Sneaky, sneaky. [I don't know where you'd get that idea. --rcade]
posted by vito90 at 04:03 PM on April 21, 2004
rcade - brilliant. Remeber your bible study vito... "A man that flattereth his neighbour spreadeth a net for his feet." Proverbs 29-5.
posted by 86 at 04:23 PM on April 21, 2004
Raiders sure as hell need somebody to play QB. If they don't get Manning Saturday (and I'm not predicting he will drop to #2), Warner might serve for a year. Though the whole idea of God Boy playing for Al Davis...
posted by billsaysthis at 04:42 PM on April 21, 2004
I think Warner should just have a blinking crucifix molded onto the top of his helmet. That would be more subtle than his spreading the word of God by getting paid millions to play quarterback routine.
posted by dusted at 05:08 PM on April 21, 2004
Hey, Kurt's far from the only Goddie lining up under center. Just saying. (Nice post, rcade, editing be d*mned.)
posted by chicobangs at 05:20 PM on April 21, 2004
Yes, chicobangs, but Warner takes the award for maximum usage of the words "God" "Lord" "His" and "Will" during sports interviews.
posted by dusted at 05:46 PM on April 21, 2004
True that. I was just making the point. Kurt is definitely the loudest in his Me-So-Holy preachitude. He's got me looking up Zoroastrianism as a possible lifestyle choice.
posted by chicobangs at 05:58 PM on April 21, 2004
The whole both teams on knees in prayer circles after so many NFL games the last few years is certainly a big turnoff for me, chicobangs.
posted by billsaysthis at 07:20 PM on April 21, 2004
I can just hear Brenda chanting ... "Oh, me so Holy! Me worship long time!" Look, no matter how great Warner's arm is (or more than likely, isn't), and how much Martz screwed him over -- Warner is a freaking distraction. Living near St. Louis, we were always waiting for the next proclamation about how the Rams done Kurt wrong from either Warner or his big-mouthed wife. Marc Bulger is a more-than-adequate signal caller, although having Chandler as the No. 2 worries me. I think this also means you'll see St. Louis seriously sniffing around for another QB in the draft. Farewell to Kurt -- it was fun while it lasted, pal ... but ya wore out yer welcome.
posted by wfrazerjr at 07:57 PM on April 21, 2004
Warner makes me feel unclean.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 01:14 AM on April 22, 2004
Put me down as another one who'd love to see an end to all the Jesus jive on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, etc. in sports. And please, no namby-pamby "they got the right to their own beliefs" crap. Beliefs are something that reside in your head, a @$%^)&(#$%& prayathon on the sidelines is conspicuous, ostentatious, coercive, proselytizing bullshit behavior. Let them earn their place on the field and stop with the Christian mafia strong-arm tactics. Does anyone wanna go there with the so-called Christian athletic organizations and their practice of targeting those not of their stripe and trying to get them run out of their various games? I expect if I were to list the names of some of the athletes belonging to some of these organizations, a lot of y'all would be very surprised to find your favorites waving the flag of intolerance.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:00 AM on April 22, 2004
lil brown bat: I expect if I were to list the names of some of the athletes belonging to some of these organizations... So what's stopping you?
posted by dzot at 08:27 AM on April 22, 2004
a @$%^)&(#$%& prayathon on the sidelines is conspicuous, ostentatious, coercive, proselytizing bullshit behavior. Amen to that, sister. Stop with the 'crusading' already.
posted by garfield at 09:08 AM on April 22, 2004
I'm not a huge fan of Kurt, his mom or overt acts of Faith, but if I went from bag boy to Super Bowl MVP, I might Believe too.
posted by yerfatma at 09:41 AM on April 22, 2004
That's true, yerfatma. If you're a not-too-wise almost ex-jock who suddenly gets lifted to fame and riches, you too might think Jebus brough you your success, because surely no one else could have. But assholiness of any stripe just puts me off my feed.
posted by chicobangs at 01:36 PM on April 22, 2004
OK, just to play Devil's Advocate here...and because I really have no problem with the proseletyzing...at what point do you say that athletes are not allowed to espouse their off-the-field convictions when they are in their element? Would the world be a better place if Tommie Smith did not raise the black glove? Would the world be a better place if Michael Jordan had spoken out against sweatshop shoe factories paying $.32 a day? Jesus H. is Kurt's cause. The field of play is Kurt's venue. If he stands on a street corner nobody listens to him. What if his cause was integration of the races in sports? Or acceptance of gays as teammates? What if he was coming out of the closet himself and fighting to be accepted? What if he was a flaming liberal working to get Kerry elected? All these things would make some people as uncomfortable as religious proseletyzing. What is it you don't like? Being beaten over the head with other people's causes? Or being beaten over the head with Jesus? Full disclosure, the only temple I visit is the Temple of Baseball...
posted by vito90 at 02:56 PM on April 22, 2004
What if his cause was integration of the races in sports vito, I think that's just it. That isn't his cause, and other similar causes are, have been, and will be, denied their time to shine by the various leagues. However, there is always an exception for this brand of grandstanding. Causes are great, but the selective nature of what is and is not bleeped or cut is the problem. Any religious overtones to sport is unappetizing. Its not Jesus in particular. Its religion in general.
posted by garfield at 03:07 PM on April 22, 2004
I don't know what my problem is with Kurt Warner, but it's a big one. Perhaps it's the platform the media continues to give the excessively demonstrative Christian, which makes him sound holier than thou. If nothing else, it sounds incredibly goofy to constantly remind people that God is your copilot. I think we get it, Kurt. Now explain to me why God keeps guiding you to SuperCuts. You're a freakin' millionaire. Leave the tithe basket a little lighter next weekend and spend the money at a professional stylist.
posted by rcade at 03:15 PM on April 22, 2004
I am opposed to proseletyzing about that which I am opposed to.
posted by dzot at 03:36 PM on April 22, 2004
They give him the platform because he's an NFL player who has reached the highest pinnacle the game has to offer, not because he's a Christian. They give John Rocker and Carl Everett the same platform. garfield, can you clarify this? That isn't his cause, and other similar causes are, have been, and will be, denied their time to shine by the various leagues. Are you suggesting that the cause to evangelize your God is similar or different than the cause to advocate your politics? My feeling is that any causes that might make some people feel awkward or uncomfortable are lumped together, and I'm wondering if you agree or disagree? And if you agree, I for one feel you have to accept the bad with the good (i.e. fighting for equality vs. evangelizing)
posted by vito90 at 03:41 PM on April 22, 2004
dzot - heh - now THAT is precisely the answer that I expect most people would agree with
posted by vito90 at 03:42 PM on April 22, 2004
I just meant that religion, and especially Christianity, is given the airtime, while such noble causes you mentioned above are swept under the rug, if acknowledged at all. Or maybe it just seems that way in relation to all the religious overtones. I don't think certain 'issues' are permissible while others are not. So I guess I agree. But I disgress to my original point of the unequal exposure, which seems a symptom particular to Christian players. So theoretically I agree, but the reality is I hear more from one cause than all other causes put together. dzot, you are against explaining, and in the process possibly convincing others, why you think the way you do?
posted by garfield at 03:54 PM on April 22, 2004
OK that makes sense. But I think there are logical reasons for it. First of all, there are LOTS of Christians and it is part of practicing their faith to witness to those around them. Second of all, athletes are just a subset of society. Some are dumb as rocks, some are average, some are geniuses. It's more likely that only the smart and articulate ones will expound on politics or sweatshops, while and and all Christians are likely to speak out about that. Plus, it will take an athlete with a serious set of stones and job security to speak out against homophobia in sports (for one example).
posted by vito90 at 03:59 PM on April 22, 2004
word.
posted by garfield at 05:16 PM on April 22, 2004
I don't think Kurt Warner gets nearly as much of a platform to espouse his views if he's a Jehovah's Witness, Scientologist, or (God forbid) atheist.
posted by rcade at 06:05 PM on April 22, 2004
vito90: They give him the platform because he's an NFL player who has reached the highest pinnacle the game has to offer, not because he's a Christian. What highest pinnacle would that be -- losing to li'l Tommy Brady in the Super Bowl? And in another post: ...I think there are logical reasons for it. First of all, there are LOTS of Christians and it is part of practicing their faith to witness to those around them. Second of all, athletes are just a subset of society. Some are dumb as rocks, some are average, some are geniuses. It's more likely that only the smart and articulate ones will expound on politics or sweatshops, while and and all Christians are likely to speak out about that. Reality check: what exactly do you think would happen if some NFL players organized a post-game huddle at the 50-yard mark to "witness" to the evils of profiting from sweatshop labor? Face facts, vito90, it is a double standard, and I have yet to hear a single reason why it merits our indulgence. Christian theology teaches that prayer is communication between a believer and God. It can be done at any time, in any place, in any manner, including in silence, which, many would argue, is the best way to do it, rather than putting on a lookit-me-I'm-so-holy public production. Sorry, you can not justify these displays as something that a Christian has to do.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 09:39 AM on April 23, 2004
what exactly do you think would happen if some NFL players organized a post-game huddle at the 50-yard mark to "witness" to the evils of profiting from sweatshop labor? It would get huge, unprecedented coverage in the news media and we would discuss it ad nauseum here on SpoFi, and would result in statements and press releases from Nike and other sporting goods manufacturers that do business in those countries. Kurt also won a Super Bowl, remember they beat the Titans and he was MVP of the league. Post-game quote: "Thank you Jeeeesussssss!" It was a big deal when Tom Brady was invited to the State of the Union address after winning the Super Bowl. From what I recall, he kept pretty mum about his politics. But he didn't have to, and I'm not sure that if he had been more vociferous (and even if he had shown himself as a Repub/conservative) it would warrant any criticism. You can argue that it would be a double standard if the anti-sweatshop crowd tried to make waves and was silenced. But until some group with an agenda actually tries and is silenced no double-standard exists. And of course it's not something a Christian has to do, it's something a Christian chooses (or feels compelled) to do.
posted by vito90 at 09:52 AM on April 23, 2004
what exactly do you think would happen if some NFL players organized a post-game huddle at the 50-yard mark to "witness" to the evils of profiting from sweatshop labor? It would get huge, unprecedented coverage in the news media and we would discuss it ad nauseum here on SpoFi, and would result in statements and press releases from Nike and other sporting goods manufacturers that do business in those countries. Right so far, but you missed the point: what would be done the huddle itself? Do you honestly believe that this or any other public demonstration -- except for Christian "witnessing", which is a namby-pambyism for proselytizing -- would be tolerated? It was a big deal when Tom Brady was invited to the State of the Union address after winning the Super Bowl. The SotU wasn't held at the 50-yard line after a football game, nor did Tom Brady ever try to hold a Bush-for-President fundraiser after the game. And of course it's not something a Christian has to do, it's something a Christian chooses (or feels compelled) to do. In my dictionary, "has to do" and "is compelled to do" are synonymous.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 03:49 PM on April 25, 2004
rcade - brilliant. Kurt Warner is going to make some team a legitimate Super Bowl contender. I don't care about the religious stuff, personally, he's entitled to his convictions. Just complete passes and you can QB my team anytime.