12/03/24
September 07, 2010
Hockey's best players by the numbers they wore, Part I (00-33): Part II (34-66), Part III (67-99).
#4: Orr before Beliveau? FAIL.
#10: Francis before Lafleur? FAIL.
#69: Angelstad over ... no one else has ever worn this number? WEIRD.
#4: Orr before Beliveau? FAIL.
#10 Francis before Lafleur? FAIL
If true, it would be the only thing Bobby Orr ever failed at, other than being unable to recover from more than 12 knee surgeries.
As terrific a player as Beliveau was (and he was fantastic), Orr was arguably the greatest player ever to lace up skates.
Jean Beliveau is one of my absolute favourite players. He was, and is, pure class.
Francis over Lafleur ? Megafail.
posted by tommybiden at 03:07 PM on September 07, 2010
Orr before Beliveau is perfectly acceptable from my point of view. Orr's peak is so damn high, it makes up for the career length issue.
Francis before Lafleur is debatable, and depends on how heavily you weigh consistency and career totals compared to peak and impact.
posted by grum@work at 04:12 PM on September 07, 2010
I disagree with 8 going to Ovechkin. It's too early to say that he's put up a better career than Selanne, as Teemu has a HELL of a resume.
Do I think Alexander the Great "owns" #8 in a few years? Unless he gets injured or leaves for the KHL, I don't think there will be any debate.
Lots of fun to be had debating 1, 9, 16 and 19.
posted by grum@work at 04:21 PM on September 07, 2010
99 was a terrible choice.
posted by Ying Yang Mafia at 06:30 PM on September 07, 2010
Orr before Beliveau always and forever.
Francis before Lafleur? Yep, that one is wrongo.
It's a little early to put Ovechkin ahead of Selanne, but it's already pretty close with the Hart and Art Ross wins. Selanne never had Ovechkin's peak (Despite the greatest rookie season of all-time).
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 06:43 PM on September 07, 2010
Selanne never had Ovechkin's peak (Despite the greatest rookie season of all-time).
Actually, according to hockey-reference.com, Selanne's 1998-99 season is equal to Ovechkin's 2007-08 and Crosby's 2006-07 season (in adjusted points).
posted by grum@work at 07:10 PM on September 07, 2010
If we're going to adjust for injuries then Pavel Bure goes way ahead of either Francis or Lafleur at #10.
posted by rumple at 08:19 PM on September 07, 2010
Orr. Orr. Orr. Always.
posted by insomnyuk at 10:53 PM on September 07, 2010
Yes, the points are nice but they aren't the whole gambit, grum. You wouldn't trade Ovechkin for Selanne in his prime. No one would.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 01:15 AM on September 08, 2010
I think a lot has to do with the writers taking away from Canadiens players from the 50s-70s because those teams were so stacked. Beliveau, Richard, and LaFleur all suffer for that. But then they turn around and give 17 to Kurri over Kovalchuk. Nothing against Kurri, but those Oiler teams were the definition of a stacked deck. Meanwhile in Atlanta, Kovie had....who again?
And Steve Heinze not even being in the discussion for 57 is a gross oversight...
posted by MeatSaber at 03:50 AM on September 08, 2010
Thank all of you who said what I was thinking yesterday about #8. As a Pens fan, I know my opinion of Ovie is bias so I didnt post it, but he is not the best #8 yet. He will be soon, but just like Strausberg, you gotta earn it.
Also, That is a coin flip on #77.
posted by Debo270 at 08:26 AM on September 08, 2010
Yes, the points are nice but they aren't the whole gambit, grum.
You're right. Selanne was a MUCH better defensive player than Ovechkin. :)
I agree that in one or two years, Ovechkin will be the best #8.
In fact, if you want to be perfectly honest, then Ovechkin SHOULD be listed as the best #8, since Selanne wore #13 for the first few years of his career in Winnipeg.
posted by grum@work at 08:59 AM on September 08, 2010
Also, That is a coin flip on #77.
Between Borque in Boston and Borque in Colorado? That seems silly, but putting Paul Coffey in the mix would be even weirder.
posted by yerfatma at 10:35 AM on September 08, 2010
With notable exceptions, this is a "Top 100 Since Expansion" list. The biggest reason for this is that numbers above 35 were rare in the 6-team league, and anything above 30 was usually for a back-up goal tender. The next reason is that the people who put these lists together weren't alive in the 1930s and 1940s, when many of the all-time greats were playing. Thus, since they have seen the more recent players, they tend to give them better marks than the old-timers get. These lists are written to generate some discussion and interest in the sport, and for this alone they are useful.
posted by Howard_T at 01:24 PM on September 08, 2010
Case in point, the Savardian spin-o-rama is unequivocally associated with Serge Savard, not Denis.
18 -- Denis Savard The Canadiens spent years regretting that they didn't take the Montreal native with the top pick in the 1980 Entry Draft. Instead, he went to Chicago with the third pick and lit up scoreboards for more than a decade. He may or may not have invented the spin-o-rama, but no one is more associated with the move than Savard, who finished his career with 473 goals and 1,338 points. Runner-up: Serge Savard
posted by rumple at 02:07 PM on September 08, 2010
Great article. Some names made it as the only one with that number but obviously alot of research went into this article. A few I would disagree with, but mostly pretty on point.