12/22/24
May 17, 2007
LeMond lets it all hang out: : Greg LeMond's testimony at the Floyd Landis doping trial takes a turn for the bizarre, to say the least.
posted by lil_brown_bat to other at 09:25 PM - 33 comments
Certainly more interesting than the Tour De France...
posted by Drood at 02:09 AM on May 18, 2007
Uncle Ron? "Hide the weenie?" What the hell?
posted by The_Black_Hand at 05:02 AM on May 18, 2007
I can't even read all that. The only thing I can hear when Greg LeMond speaks is, "I am the greatest American cyclist of all time and no one should ever attempt to be better than me. Oh, and Me Me Me Me!" It's a damned strange time to finally speak about your sexual abuse.
posted by yerfatma at 06:03 AM on May 18, 2007
I don't think it's a strange time to speak out - I see it more as a big FUCK YOU to Landis, who tried to intimidate Lemond the night before he testified. Landis has now sacked "Will", who was stupid enough to use his own phone. Last ditch PR attempt I guess - too late IMO.
posted by afx237vi at 07:12 AM on May 18, 2007
I don't get the point of LeMond's testimony. Are we really supposed to believe that Landis would confess to a man who has worked the talk show circuit talking shit about Landis? Foolishness.
posted by bperk at 08:30 AM on May 18, 2007
That's what makes the phone call so stupid. Lemond's testimony said basically nothing. Lemond urged Landis to confess and Landis replied "what good would it do?" That was it. Lemond then told Landis that secrets can ruin your life, and then told him about the abuse. That's how he knew it was someone from Landis's camp that made the phonecall and how it subsequently came out in the hearing. The fact that no-one has denied the phonecall by Will Geoghegan tells me that Lemond is telling the truth, and lowers Landis even further in my estimation.
posted by afx237vi at 09:04 AM on May 18, 2007
It's a damned strange time to finally speak about your sexual abuse. His sex abuse was relevant because Landis' manager attempted to use it as blackmail. Are we really supposed to believe that Landis would confess to a man who has worked the talk show circuit talking shit about Landis? At this point, I think the bigger question is why should anyone believe Landis? As near as I can recall, there hasn't been a single thing that has come to light since this doping allegation surfaced that has helped Landis. Everything that comes out makes him look worse. For people who think what LeMond said wasn't damning, doesn't the actions of Landis' manager demonstrate otherwise? He obviously thought it was going to put a fork in him.
posted by rcade at 09:13 AM on May 18, 2007
I'm with Amateur. This whole deal has become much more interesting (in an As The World Turns sort of way) than I ever thought it would be. His sex abuse was relevant because Landis' manager attempted to use it as blackmail. I may be wrong, but I think he was referring to the inital phone conversation between LeMond and Landis. It does seem to me to be a very odd way to illustrate how hard having a secret can be, particularly when you are talking to someone who is not exactly a close friend.
posted by The Crafty Sousepaw at 09:19 AM on May 18, 2007
As near as I can recall, there hasn't been a single thing that has come to light since this doping allegation surfaced that has helped Landis. I think plenty has come to light that has helped Landis, at least in the eyes of a reasonable person (nothing would "help" him with someone whose mind is already made up). Take a look at some of the other articles that have been posted on VeloNews. (...and probably I should have FPP'd those, but new stuff is coming up every day of the trial, and it's just kinda ongoing, so...as for the LeMond article, I popped into VeloNews last night while under the influence of a bottle of Truro Vineyards Cabernet Franc and said, "I bet this won't look nearly as strange in the morning." Oh such a very wrong bat was I.)
posted by lil_brown_bat at 09:25 AM on May 18, 2007
Can someone explain to me how you could test positive in one stage but no the next stage or the previous stage? That is what doesn't make sense to me. If you're using an illegal substance, it should at least be in ALL of the tests that occur afterwords. Something just doesn't seem right about having only one positive test on one stage. I ask only because the only doping I have ever done was with a beer and a joint.
posted by yay-yo at 09:47 AM on May 18, 2007
...I popped into VeloNews last night while under the influence of a bottle of Truro Vineyards Cabernet Franc... What year? Napa Valley leaves me with that 'strange' feeling as well.
posted by BornIcon at 09:53 AM on May 18, 2007
This is equal parts sad, frustrating and fascinating. Lemond has always been the sour-grapes type who was jealous of the successes of the people who succeeded him at the top of the sport, but to be honest, it's not like any of these people are all that nice. Nathan Fowler's piece is worth the read if you want some background and context into this whole As-The-Stomach-Turns saga.
posted by chicobangs at 10:45 AM on May 18, 2007
Crazy. I fail to see how any of this supports Landis' case.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 11:00 AM on May 18, 2007
For people who think what LeMond said wasn't damning, doesn't the actions of Landis' manager demonstrate otherwise? The actions don't seem to me to be part of some calculated effort to stop LeMond from testifying. They sound like some stupid crank call from a moron. I find it very hard to believe that Landis and Will could have put their heads together and come up with something some idiotic. Obviously, Landis told Will about LeMond's childhood abuse, but I am not sure I believe that Landis expected him to use that information to make crank calls.
posted by bperk at 12:28 PM on May 18, 2007
Would it be fair to say that this is only going to get weirder? Could this Will/Bill whoever he is possibly be in the top 20 stupidest tampering moves of all time?
posted by THX-1138 at 04:37 PM on May 18, 2007
Floyd Landis is a scumbag! The fact that he shared the LeMond info with his manager, who then tried to coerce him into not testifying is proof enough for me. I can not believe how many people continue to defend him. He is among the many that are bringing his sport down. Barry Bonds is a villain because it is believed that he did PEDs, yet Landis tested positive on both samples and has defenders? I will finish this the way I started it: Floyd Landis is a scumbag!
posted by urall cloolis at 06:08 PM on May 18, 2007
Floyd Landis is a scumbag! The fact that he shared the LeMond info with his manager, who then tried to coerce him into not testifying is proof enough for me. There's no proof whatsoever of the latter. Think for just a minute: why would he do something that would be a)totally traceable to him and b)guaranteed to land him in a world of shit? It makes no sense whatsoever. I will finish this the way I started it: Floyd Landis is a scumbag! Did you bother to read any of the many articles on the trial that include the defense arguments, or do you just have your mind made up and don't want to be confused with facts?
posted by lil_brown_bat at 06:54 PM on May 18, 2007
urall cloolis, please, reread the thread. No one's defending Landis here. But his actions aren't the only ones that are highly odd. Landis, Lemond and Lance are all less than great examples of humanity, from the looks of things. But at least Lance has some people skills. Floyd and Greg both seem kind of like dicks; Greg of the sour-grapes kind and Floyd of the I'm-new-to-dealing-with-people kind. Which doesn't help any of this.
posted by chicobangs at 07:01 PM on May 18, 2007
LBB- you might be right- maybe all of cycling is clean and Landis is just another American that won that is getting a bad shake. I am sure that the manager found out the information of child/sexual abuse by himself. If you believe that you are living in a glass house. Do you really believe it was a prank phone call? How about if your kid was to be a witness in a murder trial and the murderer's "friend" called you and said "I hope your son has fun playing basketball tomorrow at "so and so location". Would you think it was just a crank call or take it as a threat? It is a clear cut threat by the Landis Camp! Chico- There are in fact many people on this thread defending him and putting down LeMond. I agree that many of the cyclists are arrogant and not very good humanitarians. But that does not deflate the fact that Landis is the one on the hot seat now. I am not going to say that Lance or LeMond never used- just that he may be the biggest scum of the group. He is the one that is resorting to tactics that are aggressive, illegal and may get him thrown in jail instead of just stripping him of that "yellow jersey". Side note: what straight man would actually wear a yellow jersey unless he played for Brazil's National Soccer team? At least the Brazilians do not shave their legs.
posted by urall cloolis at 12:33 AM on May 19, 2007
I feel sorry for Floyd's poor mother.
posted by Fat Buddha at 05:23 PM on May 19, 2007
LBB- you might be right- maybe all of cycling is clean Where exactly did I say this? (oh, and extra points for the homophobic slur)
posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:40 AM on May 21, 2007
"Side note: what straight man would actually wear a yellow jersey unless he played for Brazil's National Soccer team? At least the Brazilians do not shave their legs." Would you like to take that up with the Australian national rugby team?
posted by Mr Bismarck at 09:38 AM on May 21, 2007
"Side note: what straight man would actually wear a yellow jersey unless he played for Brazil's National Soccer team? At least the Brazilians do not shave their legs." The Boston Bruins. I'm assuming they're all straight, not that there would be anything wrong with not being straight.
posted by tommybiden at 10:12 AM on May 21, 2007
Without any inside information at all, I wouldn't assume that, tommy. (And holy cow, did this thread ever derail.) So is anyone else watching the Giro? I find the sprints have been really riveting, which is a new development as I've always been a big fan of the mountain stages. We'll see how it pans out next week when the hilly stuff figures into things more, but Petacchi and the Aussies totally have my attention.
posted by chicobangs at 03:13 PM on May 21, 2007
I apologize for derailing this thread and especially for the comment that could be seen (rightfully so) as a homophobic slur. I still think that Landis is a scumbag all that being said. Especially since he admitted he was in the same room as Will when he made that phone call.
posted by urall cloolis at 09:06 PM on May 21, 2007
urall, I'm not disputing your right to hold whatever opinion you wish of Landis...but really, have you been reading the coverage of the trial and testimony? Seems to me that the Landis defense has raised some legitimate questions about the testing procedures -- and it's not just an OJ defense, either, picking at technicalities. In testimony yesterday, Dr. John Amory, a member of USADA's anti-doping panel, stated that the Landis test results "[don't] look like anything we've seen in men who've been administered exogenous testosterone" -- and there's a lot more; read the article. Seems to me the defense is making a pretty good case here.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:03 AM on May 22, 2007
Here is a pretty good breakdown of the science issues that have been raised in the hearing so far.
posted by apoch at 09:08 AM on May 22, 2007
Am I understanding correctly that the French lab detects testosterone at a 300% higher rate than other labs? That sounds really dubious.
posted by bperk at 11:25 AM on May 22, 2007
Yes, your understanding is correct.
posted by apoch at 11:48 AM on May 22, 2007
I let it hang out all the time guys
posted by singlen8tivedude at 05:50 PM on May 22, 2007
USADA's entire legal strategy seems to be to illustrate that Landis has bad character. The scientific evidence is killing them. All the stuff about LeMond seems completely irrelevant to whether he doped or not, yet that seems to be USADA's focus.
posted by bperk at 12:10 PM on May 23, 2007
bperk, I'd put LeMond's original "testimony" in the same category. He had no evidence, USADA just more or less trotted him out as an anti-character witness. The single smartest move the Landis defense has made so far is making this whole thing a public matter. USADA is still arrogant enough to deny the appeal in spite of the evidence and expert testimony, and they're arrogant enough that I don't think public opinion would really deter them...but it would cause the public to see their whole "process" as a sham, and they can't escape the effects of that long-term.
posted by lil_brown_bat at 01:00 PM on May 23, 2007
Strange stuff, especially the bit about "Will." This whole public-hearing thing is turning out to be much more entertaining than I expected.