June 18, 2007

Former Redskins, Giants LB Arrington hurt in motorcycle crash: Initially it looks like there is no outside influences to cause this wreck. The question now: given his recent playing injuries, is this the end of his once promising career?

posted by brainofdtrain to football at 05:15 PM - 20 comments

This might have gotten more attention had you wrote 'Arrington busted with $5 bucks worth of weed'.

posted by Bishop at 12:21 AM on June 19

one for operating the motorcycle without a proper license, What do you mean "no outside influences?" How about a lack of proper skills, otherwise why doesn't he have his endorsement? This might have gotten more attention had you wrote 'Arrington busted with $5 bucks worth of weed'. What nobody posted anything you didn't like, so you figured you would make an example for us? Hypocrite.

posted by jojomfd1 at 01:11 AM on June 19

This is such a shame. LaVar Arrington was one of the best in Washington until the injuries took their toll. I just don't get why these million dollar athletes choose to ride these bikes when they should be focused on the game. I do hope that he gets well and can continue his career.

posted by BornIcon at 05:16 AM on June 19

What do you mean "no outside influences?" I'm fairly sure that this means no other vehicles were involved, no strange road conditions (a spill, black ice, a flash flood) were present, no deer ran in front of the vehicle, etc. Did you really not understand what the term means? How about a lack of proper skills, otherwise why doesn't he have his endorsement? There are all kinds of dumb reasons why people ride (or drive, for that matter) without a proper license. Many of them are purely bureaucratic. Lack of skill to pass an operator's test is only one of a great many reasons why a person might lack a license. For that matter, having a license certainly doesn't mean that you truly have the skills to operate safely. It means that you did well enough on a set test for an examiner to pass you. The judgment that is, IMO, the most important component to safe operation is something that only comes with experience and time on the road. With "no outside influences" and no alcohol involved, it seems like there's a good chance the accident happened through a simple misjudgment, and if so, that misjudgment may have come about through lack of experience. Rookie mistakes happen, but the only way that rookies become experienced is by getting out and riding.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:28 AM on June 19

just because he doesnt have an endorsement doesnt mean he lacks proper skills.. i dont have an endorsement and have been riding for 12 years now, and i have never wrecked. an endorsement doesnt mean anything.. besides the test is a joke.

posted by jlh0837 at 10:54 AM on June 19

To respond to the original poster, it appears his NFL career was already over. Having a license or permit is no guarantee that you have the propers skills, but it does imply you have knowledge and respect of the law, and at least rudementary skills. In any case he was breaking the law and by the report of the accident had poor skills since no other vehicle was involved and he lost control of his bike. Simple misjudgement as Lil Brown Bat puts it is just an assumption. Being a rider, I can say that rider experience, extreme defensiveness, caution, and respect for the law are some of the things that can keep you alive on a motorcycle. Far too many kids with no money down and less than a hundred bucks a month can buy a bike that will do 180 mph. It too bad there isn't some sort of qualifying criteria that is required for someone to purchase a motorcycle. JLH0837 - just because you have been breaking the law for 12 years and never wrecked doesn't make it OK. That is like saying, I have been drinking and driving for 12 years and never had a crash or been arrested. It doesn't mean you are qualified to do so. It just the rationalization of a law breaker. If the test is suck a joke then it should be easy for an expert like you to pass it. Why not become legal? Is it the $10 fee? In any case he had a helmet on which is probably the reason he is alive. He made at least one good decision.

posted by Atheist at 02:22 PM on June 19

To respond to the original poster, it appears his NFL career was already over. How so? He was a force for the Redskins.

posted by yerfatma at 03:07 PM on June 19

Thanks lbb, that was what i was referring to, only i was including intoxication, drug use, etc in that phrase as well. Yerfatma, "was" is the key word for Arrington. The article does a brief recap of his career at the end, which states that after three probowl years as a skin', he was hurt and bought out his contract after his playing time was reduced. He signed with the Giants, but after six games he got hurt again, and was released. Given the fact that he only amassed 16 tackles with the Giants, it seems unlikely he was the same player after his 1st injury. Now that he has been injured again, i think tht my first question was appropriate: does this end his playing days?

posted by brainofdtrain at 05:41 PM on June 19

Simple misjudgement as Lil Brown Bat puts it is just an assumption. No, it's not an assumption. Did you read what I wrote? Here it is again: The judgment that is, IMO, the most important component to safe operation is something that only comes with experience and time on the road. With "no outside influences" and no alcohol involved, it seems like there's a good chance the accident happened through a simple misjudgment, and if so, that misjudgment may have come about through lack of experience. Now, where do you see any assumption in that?

posted by lil_brown_bat at 09:11 PM on June 19

He was a force for the Redskins. His hit on Troy Aikman (one of the biggest I have ever witnessed) that gave him a concussion and sent him (Aikman) to the broadcasting booth was a relief for many 'Skins fans I'm sure... LaVarr was, if used properly, (Mr. Gibbs take note) an immense talent. I hope he recuperates fully.

posted by mjkredliner at 10:18 PM on June 19

Did you really not understand what the term means? No I think the original poster pointed out what he meant by no outside influences! only i was including intoxication, drug use, etc in that phrase as well. Hell he probably would never have even copped to the other vehicles comment, had you not given it to him. For that matter, having a license certainly doesn't mean that you truly have the skills to operate safely. You must not have your endorsement. It most certainly means that you possess at least a minimum of road worthy, quality, tested skills. Atheist, you hit the breaking the law analogy dead on. I could not say it any more simple than that. You know even if he would have had a learners permit, most states don't even allow beginners on the highway.

posted by jojomfd1 at 01:05 AM on June 20

No I think the original poster pointed out what he meant by no outside influences! only i was including intoxication, drug use, etc in that phrase as well. Hell he probably would never have even copped to the other vehicles comment, had you not given it to him. Uhhhh...meaning that your definition of "outside influences", that is "a lack of proper skills", is what OP really meant all along, only he changed his mind? If you thought that, why your original post? He lost it on a curve. It's a fairly common occurrence. You must not have your endorsement. It most certainly means that you possess at least a minimum of road worthy, quality, tested skills. Tested? Yes, because you passed a test. Road-worthy? Quality? Maybe, maybe not. You know even if he would have had a learners permit, most states don't even allow beginners on the highway. Got a cite for that?

posted by lil_brown_bat at 08:56 AM on June 20

I can't speak for other states but, in California you must have a permit to get on a motorcycle on public roads. To gain the motorcycle learners permit you must pass a written test which includes questions on rules, and operational situations, the permit allows you to ride a motorcycle without a passenger, and you are prohibited from riding on highways and riding at night. To gain the license endorsement, you must successfully pass a riding skills test or successfully complete the on motorcycle Highway Patrol endorsed Motorcycle Safety Course. The certificate will allow you to bypass the DMV skills test but gaining the certificate means you have passed a much more stringent set of tests and completed 8 hours of classroom instruction, an extensive written test, as well as 8 hours of on motorcycle instruction and skills test. Even a lot of very experienced riders will take these courses. They are very good because you get the opportunity to experiment on their bikes doing manuevers you probably wouldn't want to practice on your own bike. Especially if you ride a heavy expensive one.

posted by Atheist at 11:13 AM on June 20

He lost it on a curve. It's a fairly common occurrence. It a common occurence only because there are so many incompetent or wreckless riders. A decent motorcycle rider can take a curve safely at the speed limit so easily it is not funny. Probably at 50% over the speed limit. For a motorcycle to not be able to negotiate a curve properly, it either has to be exceeding the speed limit by a wide margin or be operated by an incompetent rider. Unless of course there was some unusual or undetectable hazardous road condition ie sand, gravel, or oil. Nothing that was determined in the article to be present

posted by Atheist at 02:32 PM on June 20

It a common occurence only because there are so many incompetent or wreckless riders. If they were wreckless, there'd be no problem! Nyuk nyuk nyuk!

posted by lil_brown_bat at 04:27 PM on June 20

Got a cite for that? Sorry it took so long I was out of town. Here it is, have fun. Click on whatever state you would like to see and then click motorcycle to check out how to get the endorsement there. They all explain their testing procedure, and beginners restrictions.

posted by jojomfd1 at 02:18 AM on June 25

jojo, what you posted is an "unofficial" summarization of DMV regs (not just motorcycle regs) for all fifty states. I didn't go through all fifty, but what I found pretty much matched with what I expected, which is that in general, a beginner can obtain a permit of some kind (called a "learner's permit" in some states, a "motorcycle instruction permit" in others) that allows him/her, with restrictions, to operate a motorcycle on public roadways. The purpose is the same as an auto learner's permit: clearly recognizing that you're not going to develop operator skills without, y'know, operating the vehicle, the state allows you to do so, but with varying restrictions and also, in general, after having passed a written test. I haven't yet found a state that requires actual riding instruction and experience before acquiring this permit, and so -- despite having passed a written test -- a person at that level would meet my definition of "beginner". I also didn't find any common restriction against operating on the "highway" by any definition -- in California, you can't operate on the freeway, which is not the only kind of "highway",, but I haven't found that restriction elsewhere (for example, in Massachusetts, where I live, the restrictions are that you may only ride during daylight hours, and that you must wear an approved helmet and safety glasses or goggles). Returning to my original point: as I look through these requirements, I see plenty of avenues for people that I'd call "beginners" (meaning those who have not necessarily ridden ten feet on a motorcycle) to be on the public roads. I also know many, many motorcyclists, and also quite a few people who tried it, made rookie mistakes, and decided it was not for them. You may claim that Arrington's "lack of proper skills" was self-evident in view of the crash, and I would not necessarily disagree with you. My point is simply that this is a normal state of affairs with novice riders, not some kind of anomaly.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 07:36 AM on June 25

I haven't yet found a state that requires actual riding instruction and experience before acquiring this permit Since that was never asked for thats why it is not there. I made a comment on the restrictions for a learners permit. That site is only called unofficial because all the states have not gone together officially and linked their sites toghther. If you took the time to look through it you can look at the different states official motorcycle instruction manuals for their tests. I happen to have been riding on the street legally for 15 years, and off road stuff for another 6 prior to that. I know what those tests mean. You still have dodged one part of my post from the 20th. You don't have a motorcycle endorsement do you? By the way, if you want to see a state that requires instruction, look at the S.C. manual it will give you the requirements they have to have I beleive it is 40 hrs of supervised days hours, and 10 of night hours. then look at the MD requirements in the manuals, it may answer why our subject of this thread didn't have a permit. They are even more stringent then some I have seen. If I remember correctly you have to trailer the bike to the test location or have someone with an endorsement ride it there for you.

posted by jojomfd1 at 10:10 AM on June 25

Since that was never asked for thats why it is not there. What's your definition of "beginner", then? You still have dodged one part of my post from the 20th. You don't have a motorcycle endorsement do you? "Dodged"? I never noticed it, it was that meaningless a question. Never mind. I give up. You win.

posted by lil_brown_bat at 12:02 PM on June 25

"Dodged"? I never noticed it, it was that meaningless a question. This is one thing you have no idea about, because you don't do it and never have done it.Thats the meaning for the question. You want to spout all of your lack of knowledge of what a permit for a MC is and means, and what the test proves. Go take one, see if you can pass it with beginner skills. You can rent motorcycles, be my guest. Atheist from another state other than mine, OH. has the same restrictions for a learners permit. From the sound of it a good definition for beginner would be LaVar Arrington!

posted by jojomfd1 at 01:14 AM on June 26

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