04/23/24
January 07, 2004
NHL Rule 88c: "A misconduct or game misconduct penalty, at the discretion of the Referee, shall be imposed on a player who throws his stick or any part thereof outside the playing area." At the discretion of that referee, no penalty was assessed in the game against Sundin. Hey, no harm no foul, right? No one was injured and the fan that caught it, for compensation, received a signed Sundin synergy (expensive!) stick. Supposedly, he sold it for $600. Regardless of the referee's decision, Colin Campbell doesn't tolerate it: 1 game suspension for Sundin.
Damn straight. I appreciate Sundin's talents, but I've always disliked him because he's the only guy I've ever seen Ray Bourque get in a fight with. I wish Ray Bourque was my real dad.
posted by Samsonov14 at 01:30 AM on January 08, 2004
I would've characterized it as a 'brain fart' myself, but its a pretty simple infraction to call. I'm baffled why it wasn't called at the time: stick leaves hand, flies through air, enters spectator seating area. Case closed. Colon Campbell really didn't have a choice.
posted by garfield at 09:10 AM on January 08, 2004
I'm amazed he didn't get more. Imagine the hysteria if the fan had suffered a splinter from the stick shard which ended up getting infected, spreading to his body, and turning him into Toxic Man? Anyway, I bet the reason they replaced the fan's broken stick with a shiny new one is to take that legal evidence out of his hands. All in all, it'll just make it easier for the Sens to beat up on the Leafs tonight. ;-)
posted by Succa at 09:41 AM on January 08, 2004
I find it odd that the league is tolerating the ref not calling the penalty at the time, along with Nashville skipper Barry Trotz not throwing an absolute fit. Were I Predators GM David Poile, I think I would leave Barry a note asking him to be a bit more vociferous in the future. Last point, though: Am I reading the rule incorrectly, or would Sundin have received only a game misconduct Tuesday night? That would have amounted to Sundin missing the last period of the game, right? So how is him having to sit out an entire game an equal penalty? I suppose it's the only way it can be done, but I don't read the rulebook as a suspension, simply a game misconduct. Is Campbell overstepping his bounds and overpenalizing the Leafs? Are all game misconducts equal in the eyes of the NHL?
posted by wfrazerjr at 10:51 AM on January 08, 2004
Succa: You obviously haven't been paying attention to the Leafs this year. Every time they lose a player (or 4), they seem to win. Nolan, Mogilny, Kaberle and Sundin will be out tonight. That's a lot of fire power, but I still suspect they'll beat the underachieving Senators. Then again, it isn't the playoffs so it's not a GUARANTEED win. *twists knife slowly*
posted by grum@work at 10:52 AM on January 08, 2004
Actually, Sundin could have simply received a 10 minute misconduct penalty AND been up for disciplinary measures. As it is, I think Sundin (and Leaf management) knows the punishment is fair and that what he did was wrong. Imagine if this had happened to the Flyers and Roenick was suspended. He'd be whining like a child and Clarke would be tossing furniture around the office.
posted by grum@work at 10:54 AM on January 08, 2004
Grum, I live in Toronto, I'm forced to pay attention to the Leafs. I know they've been playing well minus some stars, but the Sens are missing a handful of quality players too...Lalime, Varada, Havlat (who is back tonight, maybe?), Fisher, Volchenkov, Pothier. And you obviously haven't paid attention to the Sens 10-game unbeaten streak. I think it will be one of the bigger games of the season. Lucky for me, I'll be at the ACC tonight, dressed in red.
posted by Succa at 01:13 PM on January 08, 2004
Isn't Belfour out tonight too? Or is there a chance he'll play? My fantasy team needs to know... =D
posted by MeatSaber at 01:42 PM on January 08, 2004
The Sens should take this game. Prusek has been the better minder of the two this season. Varada, well, he's replaceable. Havlat is a significant loss. Not sure on the other three, but I'd guess they aren't make or break players. Basically, the Sens have their best players available. The Leafs have Roberts and McCabe. Pilar will either win or lose the game for the buds, and probably the later.
posted by garfield at 01:58 PM on January 08, 2004
The leaf injuries, and the suspension (fair as it was), couldn't have come at a worse time. This month on the Leafs schedule is difficult AND crucial: Ottawa twice, Philadelphia twice, New Jersey, Calgary (eh, they're hot), Islanders, Atlanta, and the Habs + Washington and Carolina. At the same time, I have paid attention to the Sens' 10-game streak and I'm not too impressed. Only one of the teams they beat I'd consider top-tier. So, seeing as the Leafs will be the first challenger in a month, it should be an interesting game for sure... even without Belfour, Sundin, Mogilny, Kaberle, Reichel (hey, he's been effective this year!), and Belak. The Leafs injured players probably have a combined salary bigger than the whole Ottawa team.
posted by mkn at 02:51 PM on January 08, 2004
Varada's a bigger loss than Havlat IMO, without him the second line has to rely on Bonk for a mean streak. Bah. mkn, I agree with you about the streak being an easy run, but most of the later games in the Leafs' big streak were against the Pittsburghs and Washingtons of the East as well. Such is life in the Northeast division I guess. Ottawa can play much better than they have so far, and the Leafs are facing some duress with the injuries, so tonight will be one of those benchmark/gut-check/[adversity cliche here] games for both teams. Also, fighting. I thought Belfour was playing tonight?
posted by Succa at 03:17 PM on January 08, 2004
Belfour's injured - back Saturday. My favorite moment of the last week was when Varada went down for the year and on the same day the Sens traded for Brad Tapper. Likely unrelated, but I do enjoy the thought of the meeting where Jacques Martin bursts into the GMs office and says: "Varada is done for the year - Get me Brad Tapper!" Watch out for Roberts, he seems... Unhinged lately - injuring two Preds and Tomas Kaberle last game. Go Leafs! No Sundin is tough though.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 03:27 PM on January 08, 2004
Isn't Tellqvist still up with the big buds? I'd read that as indication of whether eagle-eyed Eddie (BOOOO!!!!!) is playing.
posted by garfield at 03:29 PM on January 08, 2004
Actually, Sundin could have simply received a 10 minute misconduct penalty AND been up for disciplinary measures. I'm not disagreeing, grum, but where does it say that in the rule? All it says is a game misconduct. I think he should get the one-game timeout ... but is it proper by what NHL Rule 88c actually reads?
posted by wfrazerjr at 03:36 PM on January 08, 2004
wfrazerjr: in game, the referee CAN call either a 10 minute or game misconduct, if he feels it's warranted. Obviously, they didn't the other day. However, that doesn't preclude the possibility of any extra supplementary discipline by the NHL (Rule 33a ): whether or not such offense has been penalized by the Referee.
posted by mkn at 04:57 PM on January 08, 2004
mkn: Gotcha. I just read that while I was arguing with my girlfriend about whether or not Campbell had overstepped his bounds. Thanks. I disagree about the first part of your statement, though. It's not a matter of whether the ref wants to call it or not. A misconduct or game misconduct penalty, at the discretion of the Referee, SHALL (my emphasis) be imposed on a player who throws his stick or any part thereof outside the playing area. The referee is left with no discretion in that rule. He calls one or the other rather than swallowing the whistle. I like how "Referee" is capitalized in the rule book, though. I bet it makes him feel all important.
posted by wfrazerjr at 06:42 PM on January 08, 2004
The referee is left with no discretion in that rule. He calls one or the other rather than swallowing the whistle. My guess is that they didn't actually see him toss the stick in the manner he did. Maybe they thought he tossed it at the boards and it pinwheeled its way over? I don't know. I would like to hear their thought process on the subject, but we never will.
posted by grum@work at 07:00 PM on January 08, 2004
As I type it is already 5-0 and I haven't even finished what now is to be but the first of many beers. Oh. My. God.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 07:07 PM on January 08, 2004
^^ heh, I knew it was going to be a bad game when I saw Welwood (first NHL game), Leeb (fifth? game. First with Leafs), and Perrot in a DEFENSIVE ZONE FACE-OFF. Not surprisingly, Ottawa scored after the face-off. A bit later, they got a lucky bounce and then all the wheels fell apart. What the hell was Quinn thinking putting those guys on a defensive face-off?
posted by mkn at 07:32 PM on January 08, 2004
^^ Same here, man. I saw that and before I could say, "C'mon Quinn, spread it around a little" - it was in the net.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 07:34 PM on January 08, 2004
I turned on the game (between shows) and it said 5-0. I quickly turned the channel before I saw another second. Then I wanted to have a shower because I felt violated. For those that watched the game, was it a case where the Leafs didn't even try, like they resigned themselves to losing after the first goal?
posted by grum@work at 09:01 PM on January 08, 2004
Ouch. I was at this game and.....ouch. Also, ow. Loved every second. But would have prefered something closer. Go Sens, etc. See you Leaf fans at the end of the month.
posted by Succa at 01:07 AM on January 09, 2004
It was interesting to read about what Alfredsson did (faking throwing the stick into the crowd). Even his own teammates admitted it was a dumb idea to taunt the Leafs like that. Yes, Succa, it's going to be a very interesting game at the end of the month. Very interesting.
posted by grum@work at 08:38 AM on January 09, 2004
I don't think it was a big deal, the stick fake. It wasn't particularly blatant or exaggerated, which Alfie would have done were he trying to mock Sundin. From where I sat, he looked genuinely pissed that his stick broke. But of course, the Leaf media is soiling its pants over it, both to raise Alfredsson's status as Public Enemy #1 in the ACC, and to deflect the fact that they got their butts kicked. I say give it a rest. But boy am I looking forward to the next game.
posted by Succa at 09:50 AM on January 09, 2004
They both know each other, and I'm sure they'll laugh about it later. Furthermore, OUCH! I couldn't even complain about the previous goal before they netted the next one. On a positive personal note, at least Smolinski had a solid fantasy showing.
posted by garfield at 10:01 AM on January 09, 2004
Domi looked pissed when he saw Alfredsson's gesture. Next chance he gets, Tie will rip out his asshole and then tear him a new one...which he will also rip out.
posted by Scott Carefoot at 10:23 AM on January 09, 2004
Correction... Alfie confessed to the deed: "I was trying to make a joke, but it was bad timing," he said. And nobody's scared of Tie Domi anymore. He's past his prime, goon-wise. That Parrat (sp?) kid looked like a decent fighter, maybe next time he'll take on someone his own size.
posted by Succa at 10:31 AM on January 09, 2004
Grum, are you going to suggest who I should get on my new Leafs sweater? Is it Horton?
posted by wfrazerjr at 10:36 AM on January 09, 2004
Pound for pound, Domi is the best fighter in the league. It's just too bad he doesn't weigh more than the majority of the players. I'm not so sure if the two Swedes wil be sharing a laugh over a beer anytime soon. Sundin is pissed he missed 'the game for first place.'
posted by garfield at 10:54 AM on January 09, 2004
I thought the Alfredsson fake throw was damn funny. Showing up the Leafs? Uh, they did that 8 minutes into the first when it was FIVE TO NOTHING. To me it was clearly a case of one team ready, one not. And it didn't help that Kidd looked like Glen Healy stole his equipment and let the first 2 shots on net in. 3 goals from the point? Hey, I like Wade Redden, but - he's not THAT good.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 12:56 PM on January 09, 2004
Grum, are you going to suggest who I should get on my new Leafs sweater? Is it Horton? I have a sweater with Sittler on it (my favourite as a kid) and I have one with Sundin (because I wanted the "C" and he was the best player at the time). Other good choices: Turk Broda George Armstrong Johnny Bower Doug Gilmour Rick Vaive Borje Salming Wendel Clark or you can go "Classic" and choose REALLY old players King Clancy Hap Day Busher Jackson Ace Bailey or you can go obscure and confuse everyone Wilf Paiement (#99!) Rocky Saganiuk Greg Terrion Jiri Crha
posted by grum@work at 01:49 PM on January 09, 2004
to raise Alfredsson's status as Public Enemy #1 in the ACC Don't forget his little boarding of Tucker in the playoffs a couple of years ago...
posted by mkn at 03:03 PM on January 09, 2004
Grum, does having a Horton sweater entitle me to free Timbits?
posted by wfrazerjr at 06:14 PM on January 09, 2004
That's a fair call by the NHL. When I saw it happen, I thought for sure that he'd get the 10-minute penalty.