12/21/24
October 22, 2010
UFC Heavyweight Title Fight Breakdown: Brock Lesnar vs. Cain Velasquez: Little did we know then that an age of superheavyweights was upon us, led by the arrival of Brock Lesnar.
So Saturday night's UFC 121 championship fight marks the inevitable clash between the man who would be king, and the king himself.
I'm on the other side of the spectrum. I really like Cain Velasquez and although I consider him to be a valid contender for Lesnar's championship belt, Lesnar is going to put Velasquez to sleep.
You heard it here first: Cain is not able!
posted by BornIcon at 12:59 PM on October 22, 2010
"Lesnar will outweigh Velasquez by about 25-30 pounds."
I don't claim to have any insight into either fighter, but this seems to be a big factor in Lesnar's favor.
posted by Aardhart at 02:04 PM on October 22, 2010
One thing that has always struck me as amazing is the speed and agility of Lesnar. Even when he was doing the crazy fake stuff in WWE, he moved so much faster than you thought possible for a man his size. Being so used to watching (as a kid) Big John Studd, Andre the Giant, and King Kong Bundy, watching Lesnar running around the ring and moving like a little guy in the air was always a treat.
I think his combination of size and speed is just too much to handle for anyone at this point (assuming that his MMA skills are improving with experience). Sure, a lucky punch could put him down, but if Lesnar gets his hands on you...you're in trouble.
Cain is not able!
*golf clap*
posted by grum@work at 02:41 PM on October 22, 2010
Even when he was doing the crazy fake stuff in WWE, he moved so much faster than you thought possible for a man his size.
Exactly! I remember when we climbed the top ropes and went for the shooting star press (jumping reverse somersault) against Kurt Angle and concussed himself with the bad landing but just the simple fact that a man his size could pull off a move like that in the first place was impressive enough.
Cain is not able!
*golf clap*
Thank you! Thank you! I would like to thank all the little people...
posted by BornIcon at 03:22 PM on October 22, 2010
Well I would like to say as a person with some fighting experience, certainly a 28 lb size advantage is something to consider, in fighting size is just not the only factor. Also while 28 lbs seems like a lot of weight which it is to some weight divisions, at this weight division it isn't that significant. It about the same as BJ Penn fighting at 170 instead of 155 which many fighters have done successfully. It can be overcome with skill. Even Royce Gracie at 170 fought plenty of guys with a far greater advantage.
Lesnar is dangerous wrestling and manhandling people, but Velasquez is a very accomplished wrestler, much quicker than Lesnar with a multitude of advantages on his feet. He is just a superior fighter all around. Lesnar will not have the massive size advantage he had over Couture, he will not be fighting a guy like Mir who far to willingly went to the ground, and although Carwin dropped Lesnar easily with punches, CV boxes better than Carwin and will not gas out with victory in hand. I really think this is the fight that exposes Lesnar as nothing more than a monster of a guy with excellent wrestling and athletic skills but who is severely lacking on his feet. As long as Velasquez can move and avoid a quick take down I think his hands overwhelm Lesnar quickly. When I watched the Carwin fight I was amazed how easily Lesnar got caught and went down taking a fetal position. He doesn't have a chin and anybody who saw Cain Velasquez KO Antonio Minitauro Nogueirra (sp?) who had about as good a chin as anybody in the MMA, knows the speed and KO power Velasquez possesses. This is really the toughest test for Lesnar to date. Should be a very interesting match up.
posted by Atheist at 04:36 PM on October 22, 2010
Velasquez can win, but I think you're wrong about having him a large quickness advantage.
And while Carwin put Lesnar down, he did not, could not, put him out despite hitting him 56 times in the first round. He was done after that (punched out completely) but he couldn't knock out Lesnar. Carwin knocked out EVERY SINGLE PREVIOUS OPPONENT prior to Lesnar. 11-0. All in the first. And Carwin was the same weight as Lenar - both in there at about 290.
He doesn't have a chin.
Again, 56 shots to the head in the first round and he didn't go out. What are you talking about "he doesn't have a chin."? Velasquez does not have a power advantage. He is not a more powerful puncher than Carwin. Not in a million years.
Lesnar is dangerous wrestling and manhandling people, but Velasquez is a very accomplished wrestler, much quicker than Lesnar with a multitude of advantages on his feet. He is just a superior fighter all around.
Every fighter that has fought Lesnar was a superior fighter with more training and experience. Every one.
The truth is that on paper Carwin seemingly had a better shot than Velasquez. Now, it's MMA and really - anyone can win on any given night - but I can't understand why you would seem so confident in the chance of Velasquez. Maybe you're right. Can't wait to find out.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 05:34 PM on October 22, 2010
Velasquez does not have a power advantage. He is not a more powerful puncher than Carwin. Not in a million years.
Agreed. I'm not sure anyone in the sport has more power than Carwin right now.
Velasquez is a great fighter but Lesnar looks to be a horrible matchup for him. There doesn't seem to be a clear path to victory for him. I think the best way for him to win is probably standing up, I don't know how anyone could keep Lesnar on his back for 25 minutes.
The UFC heavyweight division has come a long way in the last couple of years. These guys seem so much better than the previous crop of heavyweight contenders.
posted by tron7 at 02:26 PM on October 23, 2010
Lesnar appears to be a much better loser than a winner.
posted by Mr Bismarck at 12:28 AM on October 24, 2010
Well, props where props is due. Atheist called it exactly as it went down. It looked to me that Valesquez caught Lesnar with a couple shots as Lesnar opened up with the aggressive knees and it stunned Lesnar and pissed him off - and then he got caught it a boxing match that he had no chance of winning.
Valasquez was much faster and more accurate. He stayed in the pocket and just connected perfectly. Quite a show.
posted by WeedyMcSmokey at 12:35 PM on October 24, 2010
Someone needed to humble Lesnar. I think Velazquez is such a good fighter he can hold the title for a while as he really does have a great skill set for such a big guy. He is what happens when you get middle weight skills in a true heavy weight. Once you get as big as Velasquez with that kind of skill set and conditioning, relying on 20 or 30 pound of muscle as an advantage as Lesnar does really won't help you very long once the fight starts. No matter how big you are, you just can't absorb punches from a guy like Velasquez who will assuredly connect a lot. Not one punch haymakers like Carwin, but beautiful stiff shots that end fights.
posted by Atheist at 12:46 PM on October 24, 2010
Yeah, nice call Atheist. It seems I had underated the man's striking.
There were two really important moments for me in that fight. First, when Lesnar took down Velasquez, Cain somehow instantly got back on his feet, seemingly without any effort. Second, when a shot sent Lesnar falling and spinning across the mat. When Lesnar finally found himself facing Velasquez again he was instantly met with 3-4 solid shots. Velasquez was so calm in finishing him off, quite the opposite of Carwin. Really impressive fight for Velasquez.
posted by tron7 at 10:36 AM on October 25, 2010
FWIW I had been waiting for this fight for a long time. I was surprised that Lesnar beat Mir because of Mir's great Jujitsu but Lesnar proved to be too much in the second fight as Mir, allowed the fight to stay on the ground where Lesnar can impose his size strength and will.
Randy Couture is very small for a heavyweight, does not have good stand up and was easily out boxed by Liddell at 205 lbs. on more than one occasion. Although I suspected his experience would cause more trouble for Lesnar than it did, the size differential was just too much for Couture who is just really a great wrestler with great heart trying to beat a bigger wrestler at his own game. Not a good plan
Carwin catching Lesnar with a punch was not a surprise to me but it was surprising just how poorly Carwin prepared, as evidenced when he seemingly had Lesnar beat and could not remain calm relaxed.
Cain Velasquez is the best heavyweight in the world as his wrestling is world class and his boxing is also. No guy like Lesnar regardless of size, with so little fight experience is going to be able to last a round against such sharp and powerful boxing. You just can't eat shots from Cain Velasquez. That dude is bad ass. I don't see him getting beat by anybody the UFC has to offer for a while. He just doesn't have a weak part of his game. Very rare to have that kind of stamina, speed, agility, toughness, and skill in such a big powerful guy.
I always figured Lesnar was done as soon as he ate a stiff combination from a real heavy weight puncher. The guy is just a human muscle that leads with his face.
posted by Atheist at 12:51 PM on October 25, 2010
I would like to go on record as saying I think Velasquez scores the upset KO . Lesnar was caught by Carwin and basically survived virtue of the fact that Carwin was in sorry shape and gassed while dominating him in the first round. CV will not gas and has better boxing with more power than Carwin.
I see the poor stand up as killing Lesnar against a guy like this.
At least I hope so.