September 01, 2004

Oh, come on, dusted. The guy is absurd at the plate. One of these years (not this one, or next one, but I'd put a dollar on this) he'll go to, oh, the Giants or Dodgers or someone mid-season, and lead them through a serious playoff run. I really like Ichiro. He can't do any more than he's doing, he's learning how to lead American-style, and he earns his paycheck week in and week out, on and off the field. If there were more players like him, maybe I'd watch more baseball.

posted by chicobangs at 12:54 PM on September 01, 2004

I love watching Ichiro because he reminds me of the old school leadoff types that used to play in my youth. Speedy singles hitters. Not a lot of those left.

posted by dzot at 02:06 PM on September 01, 2004

Barely 4+ years for 1000 hits? This is a HOF player worth watching. He has a couple of factors in his favour for the HOF and a couple against him making the Hall. Pro: - probably the first true star to come from Japan and break the "Pacific" barrier. Sure, Nomo and others might have arrived before him, but he's the true star from the land of the rising sun. - he's won an MVP and ROY award, some Gold Gloves, and he's building up some hefty black & grey ink numbers early on. - he's only 30 years old, and has at least 3 or 4 years before the speed SHOULD drop off significantly. Con: - he started his career VERY late (27 years old), so he lost many years to build up his counting stats. - he's essentially in the downside of his skills slope (post 29 years old), meaning it's doubtful that he'll maintain this level for too long. (However, he could switch from being a slap-n-run hitter to more of a pull/drive hitter, cutting down on hits but pumping up his power stats) - he needs more of a post-season resume, although he doesn't need a championship. - since the cutoff is 10 seasons of play, he's got at least another 6 more (regardless of ability) that he has to play...it's quite possible the travel and living away from Japan for 6 more years might not be what he wants to do. That said, if he can get in 10 seasons at his current ability or even 75% of what he does (for the last 4 years of his 10 year career), I think he'll be a shoo-in for the Hall of Fame. If he should break the .400 barrier, or break the Sisler record, or be the quickest to 2500 hits (since 3000 hits would require at least 13 seasons), then that would definitely help his HOF chances.

posted by grum@work at 02:56 PM on September 01, 2004

You're right, chico, but his accomplishments seem less impressive with the Mariners being 27 games behind first. He can't be held accountable for the team's record, but he certainly has no pressure on him. No arguing the numbers, though: they are absurd.

posted by dusted at 04:56 PM on September 01, 2004

grum, no doubt that's correct but I still say this is just another reason baseball is f'ed--sorry if this violates my 'no hating' promise.

posted by billsaysthis at 06:55 PM on September 01, 2004

Incidentally, he just went 2-4 tonight. He has to average right around 1.5 hits per game to break the record, less than his seasonal average (1.63). Every multi-hit game not only moves him closer, but also gives him leeway to absorb any 0-for or 1-for efforts. billsaysthis: If opposing teams would not walk [...] Barry Bonds multiple times per game he would have a higher BA this season than Ichiro. No, no, I seriously doubt that! Look, in every conceivable way, Barry is a vastly greater offensive power than Ichiro- indeed, Barry is greater than anyone else in baseball, and the hands-down MVP in the NL as far as I'm concerned. He is one of the scariest goddamn hitters that's played the game, and I'd argue he is a greater hitter than Babe Ruth ever was. That said, when it comes to average, Barry has never been a high average hitter. Granted, he's raised his average remarkably since 2000, and his increased power and judgment have conspired to make him the most walked player in history, which in turn made his OPS and other numbers insanely good, such that now pitchers are afraid to face him. But from a batting average perspective, the fact that he is walked so much means he basically can sit on fastballs when they do decide to pitch to him, and that his average is artificially inflated: his current numbers of AB would, for most people, have them hitting .368 just a little past the All-Star break. That would inspire some .400 talk, but with the realization that by season's end, that number would be much lower. This is certainly impressive in any event, but he's not really a .368 hitter. If Barry saw more pitching, I firmly believe his average and OPS would come down (but his counting numbers, HR and RBI, would go way up). Consider: Ichiro has 572 at-bats, on pace as well to break the record for most at-bats in a single season! Barry has only 307 at-bats, due to the ridiculous and record-setting numbers of walks (he'll break 200, which no one else has ever done, and do with insane numbers of IBB). It's near impossible to sustain any high average for 265 more at-bats. If we take just Ichiro's last 349 at-bats, from June 1st through today, he is hitting 138 for 349. This translates to a .395 average! By comparison, for the whole year, Barry is hitting 113 for 307, for a .368 average. If Ichiro took the bat of his shoulders as rarely as Barry did, he might well be pushing for .400! All of this only to stress that Ichiro is a phenomenal singles hitting high-average hitter: Barry is at another level altogether, an irreplaceable god at the plate.

posted by hincandenza at 09:47 PM on September 01, 2004

Hal, you probably understand the likelihoods better than me but I still say that IBBs in the quantities issued to BB suck ass. I agree. It is smart to IBB Barry Bonds at certain times in the game. However, most of the NL managers are lazy and just decide to walk him almost every time there is an open base to do so. It's not fun for the pitcher, Barry or the fans, but it's not really "wrong" in the sense a beanball or sliding spikes up would be. There aren't too many active players in MLB that I would want to watch have an at-bat, but Barry and Ichiro are two of them: Barry Bonds (legend) Ichiro Suzuki (exciting) Alex Rodriguez (young & dangerous) Frank Thomas (still has hints of his legendary early 1990s skill) John Olerud (sweetest swing I ever saw) Albert Pujols (see ARod)

posted by grum@work at 01:04 AM on September 02, 2004

I've yet to see a well-timed slump. They must happen in December.

posted by yerfatma at 06:54 AM on September 03, 2004

While he has more extra-base hits than anyone in the majors this year I'm pretty sure you meant multi-hit games, not extra-base hits, right? Because, well, *cough*.

posted by grum@work at 01:13 PM on September 03, 2004

3-3 today so far, in the 6th... 9 for 15 in September, and now 36 hits away from tying Sisler. Watching him hit, it's such a pleasure- fighting off pitches until he smacks one right in the gap... no one can get a 3rd strike on the corner by him, simply because he's the best bad ball hitter in the majors.

posted by hincandenza at 07:47 PM on September 04, 2004

Ichiro must be eating some extra good sour plum riceballs before his games lately. That guy is something else and a true joy to watch.

posted by NoMich at 09:49 PM on September 04, 2004

And he's bunting for hits with two outs and a man on second. Goh-ooooo TEAM!

posted by yerfatma at 11:13 PM on September 09, 2004